What are the Weakest aspects of each Suikoden?(key issues Only)

[Serpent of Wisdom]

Suikoden I = actually nothing here, but... may be 1 rune slot counts well

Suikoden II = translation eror

Suikoden III = Murayama wasn't allowed to write sasarai's POV

Suikoden IV = High encounter rate

Suikoden V = glitch, many SoD were missable

[Parallax]

Please confine all discussion, spoiler free or not, of Suikoden V to the proper forum. I don't want to have to ask again.

As for the topic at hand...eh...a few things...

Suikoden I - Definitely the least polished of the six games. It's the first one, so it still hasn't discovered it's real 'identity' among RPGs, although many of the concepts from the first game are still in use in all of the others. The game's storyline has a few holes in it, most notably the transition from being the son of Teo McDohl, famous Scarlet Moon General, to being the leader of the Toran Liberation Army. It seems fast, and not quite...well, believable. As has been mentioned, the game is hideously easy due in large part to the Soul Eater Rune, but that's not really a key issue of Suikoden I, especially since its a weakness shared throughout the games. Also, personal preference here, but I find the artwork in Suikoden I to be very poor...almost difficult to look at, especially compared to the very high quality of artwork in Suikoden III.

Suikoden II - Many translation errors in several spots, and a low overall translation quality weaken at least the English version of this title. Otherwise, its war system requires basically no forethought or strategy of any kind, even though it looks like it would. As with Suikoden I, the game is hilariously easy, and the main character's very high overall stats and strong Rune (in this case, defensively strong) make most of the game quite a pushover. Otherwise, a solid installment.

Suikoden III - I found the Trinity Sight System to be a mixed bag. Although it was enjoyable to follow four (well, five) different protagonists (none of whom are silent) and get more of the 'big picture' of the storyline, and find out a lot more information about some characters that would have otherwise been nothing more than flat 108 recruits in another title. However, the system tended to overlap, forcing you to relive several parts of the game over and over again, which got to be rather boring by the second time and altogether infuriating at the third. Luckily, these overlaps were definitely the exception rather than the rule. Two other big weaknesses of Suikoden III are its rather lame point-by-point world map (made doubly lame by the fact that it's so vacant of...well, locations. Apparently all of the events in Zexen and Grasslands take place at Brass Castle. How exciting.) and its really quite lame major battle/war system. I wasn't really a fan of the normal combat system in Suikoden III either, though I have heard others liked the way characters would actually move during the battle. I actually mostly had a problem with the 'pairs' rather than six independent characters.

Suikoden IV - Honestly...I don't have much good to say about Suikoden IV. It shares basically all of the weaknesses of other Suikoden titles, except worse. The game is dreadfully short, the plot moves too fast, and most things aren't fleshed out very well. Most of the 108 Stars are of the 'you have a ship? I'm in.' variety, which is very uninteresting. The enemy encounter rate is ridiculously high on the world map, which is almost completely empty, and you navigate so slow that it's just frustrating to move between places. Probably no one would have finished this game without Viki there to ease the pain. Definitely a step backwards in basically every way for the Suikoden franchise.

Suikoden Tactics / Rhapsodia - A ridiculously silly plot. Fish men? Honestly. Also, the voice acting was very weak. I know I'm not the only one on the boards who was bothered by the way they pronounced Rune CANnons. Also suffered from an incredibly short core game, which was bolstered by sidequests, but not really enough. The ending was also somewhat goofy. I actually tend to consider this game to be the weakest Suikoden installment from a technical standpoint, though still more pure fun to play than Suikoden IV.

Also, though I mentioned this already, all of the Suikoden titles are embarrassingly easy. This is a weakness that all of them share, and really, that almost all RPGs share. I wonder why it's so difficult to make an RPG genuinely hard?
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[Sophita]

Well, I like all the Suikoden games quite a bit (they're all above average games, IMO), but I can't deny I think they have their faults:

Suikoden I - A mostly generic cast, with few characters getting a chance to shine. A lot of characters seem to have been created and assigned just to have characters to recruit - Qlon doesn't do a heck of a lot; Fuma's design is blatantly a rip-off of Kage's (or vice versa). Worse yet, several are completely useless - Esmeralda does nothing! Not even the decentcy to be a sucky fighting character! Though some of these characters have been built onto in further Suikodens, a lot of them are pretty one-note here. The translation gets puzzling at points - why is Mathiu, classified as a doctor, making your strategist decisions?

Suikoden II - Well.............. The already mentioned horible translation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm not quite sure who decided everything needed multiple periods and exclamation points, but whoever they are, they made my eyes bleed. I think the game has pacing problems; past Luca's death, the game drags without a lot of "oomph" until Nanami's sacrifice. I don't think Jowy's personal motivation is very well defined; there doesn't seem to be any reason for him to be as attached to Highland as he is - he pretty much turns traitor because the plot requires him to, IMO. The war game has no depth to it at all and is somewhat boring from a gameplay perspective though very good from a dramatic one.

Suikoden III - Pacing rears up and bites Suikoden in the butt again here. The pacing throughout the first three chapters is downright glacial; the pacing in the lst two, outright breezy. There really is no middle to the game at all - you're just starting to get the idea of Luc's plot, and then woooosh it's all up and over. It really needed a few more chapters in the middle to make it less choppy. I also hate the war battles in Suikoden III, which remind me of some playing card game more than they do of a war battle. They didn't feel dramatic at all and repeatedly jerked me out of the game.

Suikoden IV - The gameplay becomse ubersimplified here, puzzlingly - you're down to a 4 character party, rune selection decreases, and it's a pain to micromanage your party befcause they took out the damn ability to change the weapons/armor/etc of the people not in your party - making it a major pain if you like to play around with new recrutis, like I do. The story felt disconnected, and this I blame soley on the script - It could have been awesome, and I even think I kind of get where they were going with there, but it kind of flounders spectacularily. Your hero doesn't have much of a defined purpose or personality; most people just join because you've got a big big ship, evidently. The ship probably should not have been as fast as a boat ride in real-time would be, and the locations and characters in this installment are really lackluster - aside from a few really awesome characters (Kika and the Pirates, the Nay-Kobolds, Elenor, Snowe, and Cray, The Ninjas, and Ramada....uhm...), everyone feels really ...generic and uninspired.

Suikoden Tactics - Storyline gets downright bizarre in the end (Walter? Yohn? Really? And after fighting to protect Kooluk so long, why did Corselia just abandon it?). Not a lot of new characters to think about. I wish the quests were a bit less repetitive - the 900th run to the Obel ruins sucked. Couldn't they at least put in some different enviroments, battle music, something....?
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[Blazing Camp]

Suikoden I: Never played it.

Suikoden II: I agree about the translations. THat was the only glaring problem in SuikoII. Not only were there typos in the game, but in some scenes the dialogues would'nt match the character saying it (example Teresa lines when you go back to Muse). Plus some things were'nt translated at all.

Suikoden III: Both the map system and buddy system were bad. I hate point-and-click maps and there was too much backtracking. THe buddy system was worse though because it made actions hard to control. Like when a mage casts a spell, the other guy goes rushing in to attack the monster. And if that mage casts a fire spell and the guy does'nt avoid it then..ay get the picture.

Suikoden IV: Oh God, there are alot of issues I have with SuikoIV. THe #1 issues though is the overall flow of the game. It felt choppy and rushed and really uninsipried. Does'nt match up to the epic stories of II and III. The Sailing and characters were runner-ups for worst issue of SuikoIV.

Suikoden Tactics: The only issues I had was that it was too short. Though there are alot of Guild Quests that you can do, it still was a pretty short game. Sad conisdering that I wanted to learn a bit more about Kooluk and the like.

[jjrrs]

Suikoden: I agree that only one rune did limit gameplay but since the series just started and every idea got put together for the first time, I would give the game a free pass on that. A major issue I had was that the player was given so little information when it came to recruiting, plus the situation with Pahn made getting 108 stars seem more like an easter egg rather than part of the story. I guess old school games have a tendency to make the best ending very hard to get, but since the story should have ended with the 108 stars ending, I thought the game could have done a better job to steer you that way.

II: if I had to pick a problem at all with such a great game I would just have to say that at points the story did get a bit hard to follow because so much information wasn't given clearly. Also I thought there should have been more focus on Jowy's side of the story maybe with a few more cut scenes dropped in here and there.

III: gameplay wise- the pair system, not so innovative war battles, and weird graphics/camera comes to mind. I do give them all the credit for trying new things but I'd think that didn't work out too well since the only key feature that came back in the past few games from III has been the skill learning system. Storyline wise- III did do a solid job presenting the story with the trinity sight system and had some good plot twists, but so much of the story focused on key characters' solo/group journeys that it felt to me more like a FF adventure than a suikoden war epic. Oh, and a very very weak soundtrack in my opinion, I know this would be easily disputed by someone with a different preference in music but the normal suikoden music efforts just doesn't seem to be there. Every track sounded jumpy and upbeat to me with almost none that really brings out suspense or grief like all the other suikoden OSTs dose so well; when it comes to effort, if I didn't miscount I think there are only 8 tracks over 3:00 including the intro song and 2 long ending tracks which you get to hear only once, while almost 50 tracks out of 76 are under 2:00. I guess one can argue that IV's tracks are rather short as well but I thought they were much better at setting the mood and sounding unique.

IV: quite underrated as a whole but deserves to be criticized for very failed 4 people parties, weak storyline and just plain untapped character development.(my personal top issues with the game) Many other aspects of the game were not too great as well and there's too many to list but it really doesn't deserve to be treated like the worst thing to happen to suikoden. I don't recall anyone saying it was so bad and the series is dying back when the game was first released, yet many people now start their posts with "V revived the franchise and undo the damage of IV..." it's not that bad.

Tactics: #1 and by far the biggest problem to me- relied way too much on the changing of rune properties on the battle field, it's not a checkers game! I didn't get far enough to have too much of a problem with the storyline, but with a perfect opportunity to recapture the great character connections found in the first two games through a large returning cast, once again character development and interesting relationships are no where to be found with the majority of the cast; left only with previously seen yet not worth caring about fighters of certain rune property being used like color enhanced board game pieces.

in my mind, Suikoden II is the most perfect video game: super story, great character developments/interactions, emotional, good gameplay/battle system, deep but not hard to understand, ...epic war story, not too long. Every game of the series has their strength and weakness to everyone differently if not obvious, despite not agreeing with the ones that found their perfect game for now in V, I'm happy that they did in their own way. I for one am still waiting for a new suikoden game to top my favorite game of all time, truly believing that this series and only this series will be able to do it someday.
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[Ryusei]

Generally speaking, the weakest aspect of Suikoden has to be the battle system. The system is too easy to manipulate and abuse that the game becomes ridiculously easy. Even final bosses can be killed within 1 round.

[Archy]

Suikoden 1 - Going with everyone else - the 1 Rune Slot. Although even that, along withmost of its not-so-good aspects, can be understandable, being the first installment of the series.

Suikoden II - Atrocious translation. Gordeau = Gorudo? And I also didn't like how they made Gorudo look like a wimp, that battle was ridiculously easy.

Suikoden III - I didn't like the way of movement - there was something that just didn't cut it right. Oh, and the Pairs System. We can't forget about that one! The War battles as well - I'm supposed to have a darn lot of generic-looking troops, and I don't recall seing alot of them.

Suikoden IV - The gameplay. The DARNED Ship. And the simplified Rune Effects - Suikoden II and II did much , muc better on portraying the different spells of Runes.

Tactics - Near the end, Wrong element = Pwnage.
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[Sniper_Zegai]

Suikoden 1: As many people mentioned, 1 rune slot sucked. The battles and one on one duels were both rock paper scissors literally lol. However it did'nt change the fact I still loved Suikoden 1 more than all the rest.

Suikoden 2: The translation which has taken a beating already was a little off and the mistakes only seemed to crop up at major parts, but I found this more funny than anything.

Suikoden 3: As mentioned freindly fire in battles was annoying and I hated the army battle system but I did like the idea that they when battles begun it was zoomed in and thought out giving you a reason to try and train all 108 stars (not all fo them but you know what I mean) so it was'nt all bad.

Suikoden 4: Oh god the boring boat. The lack of returning characters sucked and the camera view made it hard to find characters to begin with.

Suikoden 5: The game starts way too slow as mentioned. Its hard to find out what you have to do sometimes. Final party resriction and you also cant use "the best fighter in the game" if you know who Im talking about. And although this is unrelated I only went with 3 people in my party for ages before I realised who you went to to change paryt members.
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[retrospect.]

1: it's not that there is any specificly wrong with it, but really just the misfortune of it being the first and foremost a simple basic starter kit game for the series. I think the biggest beating it took for me was that i beat it in 15 hours and never touched it again. one afternoon mostly just so i could play the 2nd. so in (no pun intended) retrospect its shortcoming is that 2 is so overhyped and heralded as the best of the series so it kills any desire to spend any time on this one.

2: overhyped, for the most part, the translation thing never bothered me, so it mostly left me feeling like i had been set up to play something on a caliber reserved for games like xenogears or gears of war (weird connection though) and was disappointed not because the game was bad by any means, but it was not the lifechanging experience i thought it was.

3: the only flaw to this game was how horrendously easy it was to get everyone. they basically walked in and sat down. the lack of pesmerga sucked too.

4: slow going everywhere. otherwise i honestly didnt mind it. i didnt hate anything, i just didnt find any of the characters to be that charismatic.

5: the only thing i know i hate about it is how hard it is to find and as such i havent played it.

T: fuck it, i love this game so much. I already love tactics games, so a suikoden tactics made my nuts spin. the only complaint i have about it is the lack of storyline, it felt almost like a first chapter of a story and not the whole shebang. so my real beef is that it left me wanting so much more.
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[Ujitsuna]

[Buff]

[redxa3]

Suikoden I - Not fully elaborated. It wasn't taken to the best it could have been hence there were odd conclusions after the game. One such error was the reason as to how Camille became one of the 6 generals.

Suikoden II - Trnslation

Suikoden III - Pacing of the game

Suikoden IV - Short, not fully taken to its best. This is gonna be long but then we all know the errors in SUikoden IV

Suikoden Tactics - I can't pinpoint it but I felt tactics lacked elaboration in mist parts. Fishmen were a bit odd and lastly the ending was just a bit odd.

Suikoden V - Overly done but then that's not really a problem
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Valence Turmeil
The Protectors of the Crimson Deep

[poorguy171]

SPOILER WARNING

SUIKODEN:
-Many of the characters receive no development whatsoever (Onil, the chefs, probably about half the cast) and play no role in the game at all. There are a lot of characters which aren't worth recruiting unless you're going after the 108.
-Translation had some issues. It wasn't horrible, but bad enough that I noticed it.
-Bad dialogue choices. You never really got to say anything except an essential "yes/no." This is probably another one of those "hindsight" things of course.

SUIKODEN II:
-TRANSLATION!!! I thought I was bad, but II had so many issues with it that it actually hindered my enjoyment. The top choice on my "most wanted remakes" list is Suikoden II with nothing more than an improved translation!
-Plot development. I feel that even I did a better job with the plot. All aspects of the plot were developed enough that I at least understood why something was happening. II does a poor job of fully explaining Jowy's betrayal, Luca Blight's character, or Harmonia's joining Highland. I also feel like a lot of the characters from I rely on that game for any development. It's not the worst in the series, but surely not the best.
-How you don't get the level 4 spell unless you got all 108 Stars. It's bad enough that you miss out on Jowy or Nanami living, but you don't even get the most useful spell for your Rune!

SUIKODEN III:
-The combination of the skill system and rune chanting. It made most magic Runes useless on anyone who wasn't a really good mage, even the heroes!
-How fire magic hit your own allies. It made sense in relation to the story, but also made the Rune useless.
-Lack of music during many cutscenes. The soundtrack had a lot of great event songs, but they were used sparingly. Some very dramatic scenes were ruined because of a lack of music.

SUIKODEN IV:
-Utter lack of complexity in almost every significant aspect of the game including story, characters, battles, and the world itself.
-The encounter rate was ridiculously high (highest in the series I believe), and the ship was so slow. You would literally get into a battle every couple of seconds while sailing. And since the game basically doesn't tell you about R1 while sailing, sailing took hours on my first playthrough.
-The lack of Rune variety. Besides characters with special Runes, the only magic you had to choose from was the elementals.

SUIKODEN V:
-Load times. They don't bother me at all, but the game would've been nicer without them.
-Easiness of battles. V offers the most customization of the series, but you rarely get a chance to use any of it because the battles are so easy without it.
-Characters are too hard to recruit? I don't know, V is a perfect game to me, so I'm having trouble coming up with any flaws that actually bothered me.
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[Luceit]

Suikoden 1- Definitely having one slot for runes, especially when I'm just drooling at the thought of using a lot of magicians...
Suikoden 2- Nothing much, but the boss difficulty spikes (Pest Rat!) were annoying at times. Also, I didn't like the randomness of the war system. (Teresa damaging Luca Blight...right.)
Suikoden 3- Walking is too darn slow, maps are too big, frustration of playing different POVs at times because they don't reveal much info about the person, Sasarai's POV getting cut off (%#$%), Luc's POV being too short (#$@#!)
Suikoden 4- Slow, slow pace, battle system, Ted being optional though he's the freaking Tenkan Star, overall look of the game, way too high encounter rates.
Suikoden 5- Load times, wonky camera, high encounter rates.
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[Scott]

Oh I LIKE this thread...

Suikoden
In all honesty, I think that this is overall my favorite game of the series. It may be the least polished game in retrospect, but oh well. The single rune slot was fine at the time, but after having 3 rune slots in the other games, the 1 Slot was not a good system, but at the same time 3 can be abused SO easily...Also, the art direction in Suiko I was, well, really really bad. I am looking for yuber, I will join you.

Limited in retrospect
Art

Suikoden II
The translation was pretty bad!!!!!!!! In all seriousness, the translation was, as mentioned by several people, very bad. I also didn't care for how vague everything seemed once you defeated Blight. It wasn't a long period, but everything felt very...disjointed for a little bit there. I am looking for yuber, I will join you.

TRANSLATION!!!!!!!

Suikoden III
The trinity sight system was good in theory, but I don't quite think it worked out. Yes, Hugo's village was burned down. I get it.

Suikoden V
the Vagueness at the very start, and the lack of development for the villains. Also, Alenia's boner for Gizel.
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