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Leb
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 Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 1:12 am Post subject: |
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Whoa whoa, Taiwan wouldn't ever ask to join the UN as an independent nation. It just wants participatory status, but China sees that as giving legitimacy to the government on the island. This is why they're forced to use the name "Chinese Taipei" in international organizations and events.
As for Tibet, the independence movement isn't exactly at a boiling point. The One China Policy also doesn't support the idea of taking military action without certain provocation (like moving towards independence), especially when such an act could spark a larger conflict. I'd rather say things look relatively bright for the People's Republic. |
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Starslasher
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 2:47 am Post subject: |
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| Scarlet Assassin wrote: |
| That's how they're being forced to intervene in Darfur, and for that reason, they're not going to screw anybody over at the moment, especially not The US |
Wait a minute, i thougth that they were forced not to get involved with darfur? China has made many investments all over Africa, and the international community was pressuring the Chinese government to stop helping the Sudanese government. Or something like that. I haven't heard too much about the Chinese in the Darfur crisis ><.
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Shrew
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 7:25 pm Post subject: |
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China has oil interests in Sudan, and thus doesn't want to get bossy with the Sudan government, lest they get pissed. So they're trying to stay distant and not be involved. For it's part, China says that its sticking to a Non-Interventionist policy (a la Ron Paul), and not getting involved in other countries' problems. The truth is somewhere in between.
So when people complain about China in Darfur, they're angry China's not involved with the solution, and is involved with the Sudan government.
As for US-China relations, stuff like this happens a lot, but it goes away fast. Anyone remember when we bombed their embassy during Kosovo? The Chinese get a little ticked, and attack American imperialism, but then grumble and move on. Unlike the Cold War, the US and China aren't independent of each other. They need our market for all the goods the make, and we need those cheap goods.
Tibet fell under Chinese rule during the Qing dynasty, which let the dalai lama rule as a religious leader with a Chinese garrison behind him. Then after World War II Tibet tried approaching the UN for independence, but it got ignored, and so became part of China. It's currently called an "Autonomous Region", but it's pretty much just a name.
China can't give Tibet up, because doing so opens a door for all the other occupied territories: Xinjiang, Taiwan, and Inner Mongolia. Then they all want independence and China suddenly loses half its territory, including Xinjiang's oil. This does not make them happy.
The much more volatile relationship is with Taiwan. As said, Tibet's independence movement doesn't have a lot of steam compared to other places. Whereas it's a question often brought up with Taiwan. I think their current president has pushed it, but most of the businessmen there don't want that, as war with China would be disastrous. It gets really complicated for the US, since we have an old treaty with Taiwan promising to protect them if ever attacked.
Yay fun death.
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Karushifa
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2007 8:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Shrew wrote: |
Tibet fell under Chinese rule during the Qing dynasty, which let the dalai lama rule as a religious leader with a Chinese garrison behind him. Then after World War II Tibet tried approaching the UN for independence, but it got ignored, and so became part of China. It's currently called an "Autonomous Region", but it's pretty much just a name.
China can't give Tibet up, because doing so opens a door for all the other occupied territories: Xinjiang, Taiwan, and Inner Mongolia. Then they all want independence and China suddenly loses half its territory, including Xinjiang's oil. This does not make them happy.
The much more volatile relationship is with Taiwan. As said, Tibet's independence movement doesn't have a lot of steam compared to other places. Whereas it's a question often brought up with Taiwan. I think their current president has pushed it, but most of the businessmen there don't want that, as war with China would be disastrous. It gets really complicated for the US, since we have an old treaty with Taiwan promising to protect them if ever attacked.
Yay fun death. |
I think the situation with Tibet is very interesting because some recent initiates to this issue (like some members of my family) seem to have this conception that Tibet was an entirely independent country until Mao's army marched in and seized control in the 1950s. Which, as you mention, Shrew, isn't an accurate conception. Tibetan "independence" gets a lot of attention in the Western press, but from what I've read, what many Tibetans (including the Dalai Lama) really want is cultural autonomy. To them, the real travesty was not that China marched in and said, "okay guys, we're in charge now", but that during the Great Leap Forward several thousand monasteries and other important religious and cultural sites were destroyed in the name of achieving a homogenous Chinese culture. Today, Han Chinese outnumber ethnic Tibetans 7 to 6 in Tibet, and many see this as a conscious attempt on the part of Beijing to marginalize Tibetan cultural identity. So not only is wholesale independence an uphill battle, but achieving cultural autonomy would not be easy either. Protecting existing cultural sites and guaranteeing freedom of religion is a start, but some see this as not going far enough. What do you do, tell all the Han Chinese to leave? Destroy the rail link to the rest of China? Perhaps the situation will improve if and when the PRC moves further away from the domestic policies that made it such a happy fun place under the earlier communists, but who knows.
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