Do you hate Snowe? <possible spoilers>

[Exile]

I thought snowe was a good plot element, they had to try to make you hate him so you could watch him attempt to then atone for those actions and forgive him. He had to be annoying to create the proper ending for the Hero and the nullification of the rune's curse.

Incidentally, I didn't hate him although I didn't like his personality he was very much necessary and quite the interesting character in my opinion.
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Cry woe, destruction, ruin, and decay -
The worst is death, and death will have his day.

[Lerayl]

Well, I said that they were treated badly based on the accusations they threw at Snowe ("You have no idea how we've been treated") when he tried to dock at Razril, and that we know for a fact that Katarina was tortured. Of course, at the end of the game the Razril citizens also reflect that they got off relatively easy compared to the other island nations, so there's that, too.

What Snowe did at Brandeau's attack was hardly admirable, but it was very, very understandable given his circumstances. He simply wasn't ready for his position, but he was pushed into it anyway. This doesn't excuse him at all - his unwillingness to admit to himself and everyone else that he wasn't ready could have cost a lot of lives if it hadn't been for Hero4's intervention - but honestly, some people genuinely aren't cut out to be in the military. Additionally, he shows shame at his actions and repeatedly tries to make up for that cowardice in the future events (even though this only leads to him screwing up more badly, he does try to correct his behavior).

[Beecham]

Croix, no offense, but if you think Snowe is evil then you made up your mind before you even began this thread and have refused to read a word that anyone has said. Not one word. There's a huge, huge difference between being a coward and being evil. There's an even large one between realizing you're a coward and doing what you think is right - even if it is unpopular - and being evil.

And uhm, stupid question, but who the hell is Kenji?

EDIT: Ah, the curse of the next page button. Keep missing the stupid thing below the quick reply box.

[Dakota]

:cry: Harukaze hurt my feelings, j/king but I have read peoples stuff (skipped a lot because it was long) but I am so angry still at the fact of his cowardice and betrayal and the only fitting punishment is death by blunt objects but Snowe is interesting in his own "special" way. While Im on the subject how was selling Razril out to Kooluk good for the citizens???? They tortured Katarina lord knows what else happend while the main character?
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Its height.

[John Layfield]

Here's the logic.

If Razril surrenders to Kooluk then Razril fleets as well as the Razril Port don't get the holy hell blown out of them by giant rune cannons.

Remember, Snowe knew of the giant rune cannon-balls. He was right in assuming they were going to Kooluk. He probably assumed that Kooluk could've used them on Razril, just like they did at Illuya.

He 'sold Razril out' to prevent another Illuya.
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One day, I shall come back. Yes, we shall all come back. Until then, there must be no regrets, no tears, no anxieties. Just go forward in all your beliefs and prove to me that I am not mistaken in mine.

[Beecham]

Exactly. In fact, finding the rune cannon shells, the largest ones in existance, is what cracked his nerve in the first place, before Brandeau even showed up. Imagine seeing the evidence of Iluya, and knowing that no only did they have that power, but they had that power in -spades.- He didn't say he found one or two shells, he said that's what their cargo was; sounds like a lot of shells, to me.

I agree with you that he was a coward in the face of Brandeau, but I challenge any one of you to be put in his position and do any differently. Try to think of -all- the steps leading up to the events before you condemn him for it.

[John Layfield]

Let us also take into account that this was Snowe's first command and first battle that wasn't a mock training battle under the supervision of Commander Glen Cott and the Gaien Knights.

Also consider that the ship took significant damage before Snowe had a chance to respond. And that he was still suffering from the revelation of the super rune cannon-balls, a mis-hit could've torn that ship in two instantly.

And also note that comparison to the Tenkai's deeds should not be made as 1) the Tenkai was a prodigy and was not the standard for recent Gaien graduates and 2) despite keeping the ship afloat, they were still boarded. Which is exactly the same error Snowe made in his final training exercise before graduation.

It doesn't excuse his actions, of course, but the Tenkai and the Gaien Kinights are also guilt of insubordination and no-one seems to give them a hard time over it.
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One day, I shall come back. Yes, we shall all come back. Until then, there must be no regrets, no tears, no anxieties. Just go forward in all your beliefs and prove to me that I am not mistaken in mine.

[Beecham]

Totally forgot about that. Snowe's orders before he fled himself was that his ship should flee, which -would- have saved the life of his crew. The Tenkai chosing to stand and fight might have saved the merchants, but cost the lives of every single Gaien Knight on board their vessel. And everyone hails him the hero.

[kuwaizair]

[Genome Soldier]

Nah... I think he's okay. He realizes his mistakes in the end anyways, that and he's a formidable fighter.

[Lerayl]

Helmut may or may not have actually been directly responsible for the bad treatment of the Razril citizens - Troy oversaw the truce with Na-Nal, and the horrible treatment and massacre there was done entirely behind his back. But I agree that Helmut doesn't seem the type to encourage that kind of behavior.

The execution things - funny thing is, the only time I got the feeling he was trying to guilt-trip you is when you off him during the pirate phase - when he's at his angriest and is actively lashing out at the Hero. The other times, he really came off as sincere to me. I actually respected his complete lack of guilt-tripping and pleading towards the Hero at the end, when you pick him up out of the ocean before your final decision.

[Beecham]

He's slowly becoming one of my favorite characters in Suikoden, honestly. He's possibly the most in depth character yet, that's for certain.

[Lerayl]

Yep, Snowe is definetely my favorite characters in Suikoden IV and one of my favorites from the series on the whole. The boy has a way of growing on you like a weed, somehow. :P The only thing that frustrates me about him is that we don't get to see most of his character development - so throughout the game it felt like there was some astonishing character evolution going on that I only got to see glimpses of the high points of. Woe!

[Beecham]

Perhaps something whatever novel / manga / etc to fill in, when - and not if - they do it. The first two both had novels, the third has a manga, there're random character stories in another collection of novels... I'm sure, somewhere, they'll fill in the blanks.

[Dakota]

Harukaze back to your statement about the hero and every single Gaien Knight dying. it wasn't his fault, Brandeau used the rune the hero could o nothing about it. Plus he was hailed as a hero because he killed Brandeau. Those r my two cents back to the topic of Snowe. If I was geting attacked by Brandeau I would have wet myself and fled like a ninny BUT I would would admit my fright not like Snowe did trying to make excuses bah!
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Its height.