Massacre at Virginia Tech

[Gil-galad]

article

I know that posting news stories has recently been frowned upon, however I really think this story is important enough to warrant a thread, and I believe there is more to discuss than just the story at hand. It would appear that earlier today 22 people were killed at the campus of Virginia Tech in Blacksburg, Va, and another 28 were injured. The police have said that the suspect in the shooting was among the dead, however.

This leads me to the discussion topic at hand. Safety in schools. Obviously safety at a University, and safety in say, a High School are very different, but I believe they're both pressing topics. With this recent shooting, and remembering back to events like Columbine, do you think there is enough security in place at our schools? hum.
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[Yvl]

It's no wonder why schools are becoming frequent places for killing sprees. The amount of stress put on someone can drive them to insanity. I should know, I've been there. Some of the teachers you get are absoloute sadistic bastards that pile enough work on you to question humanity in general. Combined with crazy expectations that some parents have beaten into their children wihout considering that their offspring are indeed human beings, not their dolls or a means of conveying their failed ambitions... breakdowns like this are bound to happen.
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[Geddoe]

I honestly don't think so.

When I was in college [I graduated in 96], the most we ever felt ourselves having to worry about was being on campus late at night and after major campus events, because there were a rash of seuxal batteries on our campus. The campus police department wasn't very large to deal with 40K students in and around every day, 5/6 days a week.

On top of that, I see every day my alma mater pouring money into their athletic department and their med school and receiving federal grants for this thing and that thing, but I've never once seen any monies going to improving campus security, or increasing the number of officers on duty [at least not publicly]. It's a long time before my little one goes off to college [12 years - she starts Kindergarten this year] but even now it's something for me to consider.

Something else - I didn't worry half as much about my safety on campus as I will find myself worrying about hers when the times comes for her to go. My prayers are with the people up there as they deal with this horrific tragedy.
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[SolemnSound]

I never was worried about security at any of the schools I went to. [Unrelated racial generalizations removed]

My college is much of the same way. [Unrelated racial generalizations removed]
Our security here is very relaxed they only have a few on duty at a time and they dont even carry flashlights or anything lol but there has only been one thing that has happened at my school where I thought my safety was in question.

I was at the dining hall with my girlfriend at the time and we always ate lunch late on this day since it was right after our class and our class didnt end till like 1:30 or later. Anyways it was just me and her in the dining hall we were just sitting there and chatting while eating and suddenly we hear this yelling. [Unrelated racial generalizations removed]

I actually wanted to leave while this was happening but for some reason my girlfriend wanted to stay and watch. I told her I would come back to haunt her if I died here lol

[Edit: Vextor]
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[Geddoe]

Okay, okay. Just before this gets really...interesting, I would like to ask the following things from all future respondents:

1. Please answer the question presented and
2. Leave generalizations of others out of it.

It just makes for a nicer topic. Thanks.
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[Vextor]

No amount of increased security will stop this sort of thing, especially if the culprit is a student (although I haven't heard if that's the case). Collges and universities are more open and harder to secure than highschools anyhow (multiple buildings and many access points). You can't put a lid on this problem because it won't go away-- the cause lies elsewhere anyhow and it's complicated. Banning the sales and ownership of firearms? Well, people will still be able to buy them in the black market. More "moral based" education? But you'd still have people who show aberrant behavior. Perhaps things like this will simply continue to happen and there's nothing we can really do about it.

[John Layfield]

It's not a matter of security. If it was, Canadian, Australian and European colleges would be brimming with homicides. The problem goes deeper than that.
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One day, I shall come back. Yes, we shall all come back. Until then, there must be no regrets, no tears, no anxieties. Just go forward in all your beliefs and prove to me that I am not mistaken in mine.

[Anais]

I can only speak for middle schools and high schools, but I think that most schools aren't prepared for violence. It seems to me that security only becomes an issue after an incident, and at that point the damage is already done. If the threat was false or stopped in time, members of the community are already terrified; if the threat wasn't stopped, then people are already injured or dead.

I've noticed that schools have "lockdown drills" and act like the problem is solved, as though a gunman would be fooled by darkened rooms and locked doors. Honestly I think it's less for actual security/safety and more for peace of mind.

But also, I don't think that the schools are entirely at fault for being unprepared, given the number of hoaxes that turn up. My school has had two security incidents in the past two years. The first was a threat of "Columbine part two" last year. It happened to be some fool's senior prank, and the district tried to make an example of him by pushing for the maximum 20 year prison sentence and $20,000 fine (he was eighteen at the time). The second threat was yesterday night. Someone phoned in a bomb threat for two middle schools and two high schools, so they canceled school today for investigations. No one thinks that the threat was genuine. IMO, the public is sort of desensitized to school shootings and bomb threats, so certain people think that it's okay to joke or lie about.

[Yvl]

[Geddoe]

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/04/16/campus.security/index.html

I'm just throwing this link here to add to Gil-chan's original discussion so that we have a little more information to discuss. Enjoy.
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[Amyral]

[Tullaryx]

We really can't say or even guess as to what set-off this specific gunman in Virginia Tech. The fact is that he hasn't even been confirmed as being someone affiliated with the University. This factor alone just reinforces the fact that security in colleges and universities cannot be foolproof.

As several have always mentioned these types of schools are designed to be open and accessible to students, faculty and guests in every way. Sure, there are security measures in more sensitive areas of the campus, but overall one could enter any building in a college/university campus and not be stopped by any type of security checkpoint. This is how it was in my day when I went to San Francisco State University in 1991-92.

Maybe security has changed since then, but an individual determined to cause as much damage and havoc will find a way to the densely populated campus buildings. Really, security measures I've seen in colleges and universities now are quite lax and minimal compared to what one finds in high-rise security. I've worked in the security industry for over a decade and can attest to that fact. College and university presidents do not want a campus that resembles a place under siege with metal detectors, security checkpoints and other forms of security to keep students and faculty safe. These visually overt types of security adds a certain level of safety to a campus, but it also gives it a negative image.

Since Columbine, I actually think that high school security has improved and I deem much better than one finds in colleges and universities. I think in high school, parents would rather have a higher level of security if it means keeping their kids safe. Also, inner-city high school campuses have become some of the most secured places in the country that is not a government, military or high-rise complex. Unfortunately, this is due to the surrounding environment of drugs, crime and gang activity. These inner-city schools will have levels of security that would not just keep the students inside safe, but also separate the outside environment from intruding upon the campus.
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[Malvagio]

Indeed this is an awful tragedy that has happened, no amount of explanations are good enough for these 31 people's families who have passed on. When I first saw the news this morning, I thought maybe it had to do with a copy cat of Columbine which happened 4/20/1999.....but seeing how I am four days off it is an entirely different case in Virginia. These type of occurrences ruin it for students because I'm sure now the rules will be much more strict in dormatories as well on campuses out of fear this will happen again.
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"Devoted Protector of Lord Logg and Lady Valeria"

[Yvl]

[Sniper_Zegai]

School shooting in England are never commited by students, there have been a few incidents with adults who target schools but this is a rarity to say the least in England. I hear this sort of thing happens alot in america but not many people are killed like in this incident. I guess my opinion as to what should be done is the same as what I posted in the "Rights to wield arms" thread. I dont think guns should be legal in any country becuase of the simple fact that guns are lethal machines designed for killing and are insanely easy to use. I dont think this will ever happen in America but I hope most countries will learn that fire arms are too dangerous to be given to the general public.
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