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Ryusei
Kotetsu
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 6:13 am Post subject: |
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From the information we have received about the Suikoden world, I'll choose Falena as the second most powerful nation in the Suikoden World. Of course, I cannot say this speculation of mine will be correct since we have not yet received enough information from other countries. Who knows, maybe Zelant, Gaien, The Nameless Lands or even Kanakan can match Falena. But for now, I'll choose Falena over the other countries which have been revealed as the second most powerful nation. |
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Masa
Fightin' Nac Mac Feegle
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 10:10 am Post subject: |
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Considering that the Toran Dwarves have all their futuristic weapons and stuff apparently set aside for the 'end of the world', I wouldn't be surprised if the dwarves, by theirselves, could maintain a stalemate with Harmonia. Like, a Nuclear Cold War. Seriously, that Vault could easily just be a missile silo. _________________
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Rune hunter
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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Personally I have always thought the Grassland would be the top contender for second most powerful nation(for lack of a better term) in the suikoden world. Considering they're the only nation we know that has beaten Harmonia not once but twice. |
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Masa
Fightin' Nac Mac Feegle
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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In its prime, perhaps. During the first Fire bringer War, Grasslands was a lot bigger. It included what is now Zexen, lots of Tinto territory (the Wingers may have even been Grasslanders), the Lycanthrope village, LeBuque/Kaana Clan, and some pretty strong leaders in the form of the Flame Champion, Geddoe, and Wyatt.
But the whole time they were only repelling Harmonia and only doing so with moderate success. They clearly lost ground (Le Buque) and because of the True Fire Rune exploding, signed a treaty with Harmonia. Had the war continued, I think Harmonia would have won.
In modern times, the Grasslands continues to shrink. Harmonia still has Le Buque (and likely the Safir Clan) in their territory. Zexen and Tinto continue to spread their borders through Grasslands, causing those clans that refuse to become 'nations' to become closer and closer together. The Karayan Clan already moves a significant distance from their old home, if you look at maps that depict their old home. It's never specified where the Lizard Clan used to live, but its referenced a few times in the game that they had to relocate to Great Hollow.
And the Grasslands, alone, didn't repel Harmonia. It was only by allying with Zexen they actually were able to keep defending their homeland (and if not for Luc's treachery, who knows how long that would have lasted). Had Zexen remained uninvolved, Grassland would have been overrun fairly quickly.
I would suspect if we ever saw a Suikoden game significantly in the future (say 50 years or more after Suikoden III), the Grasslands would either have become parts of existing countries (Tinto, Zexen, perhaps Dunan) or been reconstructed into an actual country with a standing military by the remaining clans. _________________
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mumbay
White Maiden Mercenaries
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 10:49 pm Post subject: |
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From what we know i would have to say zexen. Because to me we don't know exactly what happened to the island nations really other then they became a federation and such. We don't know any more for falena and toran or others muchily.
Zexen is strongest because it was winning the war with grassland, i'm from zexen. as well as the fact that they kicked harmonias butts as well as who won the fight between lilly and chris((chris since she was capable of holding her own)).
Falena, Toran , dunan, harmonia, grassland. Well for one Harmonia, Falena, and grassland is amazingly huge. It would be amazingly difficult to give messages in those areas except for falena since they got the feitas river. all the choices i mentioned except harmonia don't exactly have a superior military, they all seem to have people torn between their own personel decisions from whati seen.
All the other places sauch as armes, zelant, nameless lands, gaein we can't say much since we don't know as much about those places. |
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uwangski
Lilly's Loyal Guards
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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mumbay wrote: |
as who won the fight between lilly and chris((chris since she was capable of holding her own)). |
I'm pretty sure nobody won, as nobody lost either. They've become friends after that, which is quite nice. Anyway, we can't really judge their military strength by who won that fight, can we?
As for who's the second most powerful nation out of those nations revealed, I'd have to say Falena, for Suikoden V reasons. Aside from that, they are geographically isolated from Harmonian threats, which could be a plus. _________________
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mumbay
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 11:59 pm Post subject: |
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i need to say something about that comment. Falena got infiltrated by a spy from harmonia so that doesn't make them as isolated from harmonia how ever it does take it longer for messages to be transported and stuff and you also can not forget about internal conflict you just mentioned one aspect |
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Masa
Fightin' Nac Mac Feegle
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Posted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 12:07 am Post subject: |
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Zexen wouldn't be a very high competitor in my opinion. Their attempts to even defeat Grasslanders (basically Karayans and Lizard Clan) never met with success. In fact, I really can't recall Zexen actually having a victory. In the very beginning, they were routed by Grasslanders and forced to burn down the Karayan Village. In the previous attack, not shown in the game, the Grasslanders were able to kill off the Zexen's captain and vice captain Galahad and Pelize. Hardly a good sign for their military might.
Their knights aren't bad, mind, but they're not exceptionally great either.
I don't think Harmonia has any problems with their troops, per se. Suikoden III was an unusual event since Luc was appointed Bishop out of nowhere, essentially. Had the operation been spear headed by Sasarai alone, it wouldn't have been too long before Harmonia had taken the Grasslands over. Ironically any military action we've seen by Harmonia was only foiled due to Luc. We've yet to see what they're really capable of. _________________
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Yvl
Sanctus
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Posted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 12:31 am Post subject: |
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Grassland is large, but it's mostly open space. Plus, they really don't have enough discipline to stand up to the other nations. Zexen, as Masa said, really hasn't shown any potential. Zexen itself was utterly corrupted in Suikoden 3, the knights had to act on their own to fight against Harmonia. _________________
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Ryusei
Kotetsu
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Posted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 5:19 am Post subject: |
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Yes, this is exactly what I think of Grassland. Though they have some of the strong and unique races, they aren't unified enough to be able to stand a chance against some of the more united nations like Falena. The only times the clans will unite is when they really need to. Add that to the fact that some of the clans are already under Harmonian rule (Le Buque, and probably the Safir clan) and that the clans don't have their own stronghold to call a base (the Great Hollow is probably what they have best), they would hardly stand a chance. |
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Drake Silvermoon
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Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2006 4:11 pm Post subject: |
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I would hafe to say the Toran Republic. They reclaimed lands they lost during the civil war that the city states took. They only sent 5,000 soliders to the aide of the City States in 460. The other Kingdoms lost power like the City States lost Tinto when they formed there republic, thousaneds of soliders. Grasslands are a bunch of tribes that only worj together when attacked or they want something. Zexen is to messed up because power is split but the console still gets the last word. The Iland Nations is mainly a navel kingdom. The Queendom Could go for second but we are left with no real information right now. There are other knigdoms but until they show up it looks to me that Toran wins. |
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