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| Which is better? |
| Final Fantasy VII |
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65% |
[ 28 ] |
| Final Fantasy VIII |
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34% |
[ 15 ] |
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| Total Votes : 43 |
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Njord
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 Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Bugg wrote: |
| Most people consider that the major points of RPGs are the story, the characters, and the battle system. Those three are the more commonly used reason to judge a good RPG or not. And IMO, the music and graphic fall into the more minor parts along with translations, difficulty, length of game, voice acting (if any), and so on. |
You have a good point there Bugg and I do agree with you but as you have said ,most people don't consider music or graphics as a major points of a good RPG, so you might say that I'm one of the few people who consider it otherwise, and I wasn't really talking about other people when I wrote my opinion because every person have a different point of view than others and even when they do have a similar opinion there have to have something that differentiate them from each other.
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| But on the other hand, no matter how good the music and graphic of a game, it wouldn't be considered as a good RPG without a good story, character, and battle system. |
You are also right in here and I agree with you but the real question is would you play a game with good story, character, and battle system but without a decent music and graphics (am not going to say beautiful... just decent), if so then your just different than me and it's normal because no one is really the same.
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| Obviously we play RPG not to listen to the music (I agree with you, good music would sell the soundtrack, but exactly what I meant, if you want to listen to the music, you buy the soundtrack and not play the game), and we play RPG not to look at its pretty graphics (I'd rather watch a movie or anime or whatever if I want to look at pretty graphics rather than playing RPG). |
Yeah maybe so but as I have said different people have different opinions and I'm one of the people who won't play a game with a bad music or bad graphics even when everything else is top notch.
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| As for FF VIII having interesting characters, could you please elaborate a bit on this? Because so far you've said that they are interesting but never really mentioned why. I'm interested to know the reason because I just don't see how they are interesting at all. No offense of course, I'm just trying to look at them from a different point of view, and who knows if you might be the person who would make me want to play FF VIII again. |
That might be hard because the word interesting do have a different meaning or definition from one person to another and in general everyone have a different kind of interest in the same object.
For example, if I say that an X character is interesting because he is funny another person might say that I'm wrong and that X character is not funny at all though he will give a different reason for making the X character interesting.
So, if I say that a certain character is interesting because of a certain thing you might not agree with me and the reason for that is because:
1- We don't have the same opinions.
2- We see things from different angles.
3- We don't think the same way.
Anyway, you might find that my reasons for liking Final Fantasy VIII's characters are a bit silly but that is just why I find them to be interesting and they won't even make you think again about playing the game once more.
I'm not going to compare between the characters of the two games because there is no need for it.
Talking about the main character:
Squall: a silent handsome man with a solid will and big ambition, a good fighter with a cool looking weapon, his change from a self-centered person to a loving caring one gave him a unique charm (the only reason for his change is his love to Rinoa... who could really blame him, love do change a person).
Rinoa: a beautiful young girl with a pure heart and caring nature, a good fighter with a cute looking dog "Angel", she is an honest and lively person who makes you relieved when looking at her (another interesting thing about her sorceress power and the wings on her back).
Quistis: a dazzling young woman with a smart look and strong will, a great fighter with some unique abilities (and a powerful whip), she is a determined person who feels obliged to protect the people around her and would put her own life in danger when is needed (she is interesting because she is the only person who you can count on).
Selphie: a cute looking girl with a funny attitude and kind heart, a good fighter with her Nunchaku, she always try to look cheerful even when she is sad or upset and would do anything to see a smile on the faces of the people around her.
Zell: a rude boy filled with honor and courage, a powerful fighter with his gloves, his point of weakness is his temper and his point of power is his sense of humor (he may act as a spoiled brat in the story but he changes into a dependable fighter in battle... and I like his tattoo).
Irvine: a young man who can be described as a lone wolf, a good fighter that uses his gun with great efficiency, he is a serious person toward his enemies and a sensitive person toward his friends (especially toward the opposite sex).
The above descriptions for each main character are my reasons for liking the Final Fantasy VIII's characters.
There are also a lot of other interesting characters from Final Fantasy VIII like Edea, Laguna, Ward, Kiros, and Seifer, so not mentioning them doesn't make them less interesting at all, it just that I didn't want to make my post more longer than it is right now but if you to know why I like them I would be more than happy to tell you in a later time.
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| For the junction system, the way I see it from your explanation, it's more of a tedious task than challenging. |
I might have exaggerated the challenging part a little bit so there is no need to argue about that thing any more.
At the end, I just want to thank you Bugg for telling me your thoughts on what I wrote and it is a pleasure discussing our two different points of views with you.
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Aurelien
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| Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 7:27 pm Post subject: |
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Ah, thank you very much on the characters, Njord. I think it sort of given me a little bit different point of view, and might be enough to make me restart the game.
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Esra
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| Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 7:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Goodness! Do you even have to ask? FFVII is better by far. If they had taken more time in working on FFVIII's battle system then it probably could have held a candle to it. But it didn't, that and the storyline wasn't too great either. |
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Arevus
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| Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 9:52 pm Post subject: |
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I voted FFVII because I simply liked it more, not really in the mood to argue about the differences of the game, Bugg and Njord have already done that. I would like to ask Njord about his thing with, graphics make a game better. Haven't you ever played FF VI or Chrono Trigger?! Thats where its at!
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Starslasher
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| Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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Oh, i'm so confliected! I just can't choose either! Besides, FFVI rocks! :P
Here's what i found the pro's and con's for each of the games:
Final Fantasy VII
Pros
Good plot
Chocobo Racing
Ability to have more than 4 commands
The Weapons
Normal battle music (i'm very infatuated with it)
Boss Battle music (again as much infatuated with it as the previous)
Sephiroth.....music, "One Winged Angel"
Tifa (sigh..... :wink: )
Cons
Palmer
That Don guy
Final Fantasy VIII
Pros
Zell Dincht
Speed
Junction System
Side quests (odin, research facility)
Laguna
Laguna's battle music
Premontion (Final Battle Music, Edea's battle music at end of Discs 1 and 2)
Succession of Witches (Edea's normal music)
Cid (Best of all the cids IMO)
Cons
No accessories
Love story....too mushy
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Drizzt
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 2:39 am Post subject: |
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You sum up the good and the bad parts of each Final Fantasy quite well, Starslasher, and I pretty much agree on the Pros and Cons that you listed in each game. Oh and about this topic in general, just imagine the crazy flaming that would be going on if this topic was listed on the Gamefaqs message board...Well that has been going on for many years now but that is not my point. Whew, Flamers would have a ball in this topic...those damn losers...do not and will never understand the words IMO.
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Njord
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 4:50 am Post subject: |
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| Arevus wrote: |
| I would like to ask Njord about his thing with, graphics make a game better. Haven't you ever played FF VI or Chrono Trigger?! Thats where its at! |
That's another case Arevus, because your talking about the old generations game and at that time Final Fantasy VI's graphics were considered pretty good for a 2D environment, so you could say that at that time Final Fantasy VI's graphics had a role in making it popular, and the same thing goes for Chrono Trigger.
These two games were actually old SNES games, and at that time the two games graphics were one of the bests, so you can't really compare between the graphics of our recent time and the graphics of the SNES time, and if I was living in the past I would still say that graphics have a role in making a game better.
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Aurelien
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 5:45 am Post subject: |
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| Njord wrote: |
| That's another case Arevus, because your talking about the old generations game and at that time Final Fantasy VI's graphics were considered pretty good for a 2D environment, so you could say that at that time Final Fantasy VI's graphics had a role in making it popular, and the same thing goes for Chrono Trigger. |
Sorry I just have to comment on this bit. If you think that way, wouldn't FF VII's graphic fall into the same category? It's practically the first (famous) 3D RPG in US, and basically would be considered as good graphics at that time. Yet, you compare the graphics of both FF VII and FF VIII straight away.
Don't get me wrong, I agree that FF VIII's graphics is better than FF VII if we compare it now, but if we take into account of the time when those two games were released, then they were both equally "good".
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Njord
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 8:42 am Post subject: |
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| Bugg wrote: |
Sorry I just have to comment on this bit. If you think that way, wouldn't FF VII's graphic fall into the same category? It's practically the first (famous) 3D RPG in US, and basically would be considered as good graphics at that time. Yet, you compare the graphics of both FF VII and FF VIII striate away.
Don't get me wrong, I agree that FF VIII's graphics is better that FF VII if we compare it now, but if we take into account of the time when those two games were released, then they were both equally "good". |
You have a good point in there Bugg, but let me first explain some things:
I only talked about Final Fantasy VI and Chrono Trigger because these two games were way too different from our recent times games and because they were similar to each other in matter of graphics (they both were in 2D) and practically from the same period and because Arvevus commented that they are good games even when they don't really have good graphics.
Another reason for that is because these two games are under the 2D generation of games, which is the reason why I said that in there time they were considered as games with good graphics because all games looked like that when they were released though if they were released at this time I would totally say that they are games with bad graphics.
Therefore, there is a big difference between the 2D generation of games and the 3D generation of games and it is impossible to compare a game in 2D to a game in 3D (in matter of graphics of course).
Now, coming to when I compared between Final Fantasy VII and Final Fantasy VIII, I did it because both of the games use the same graphics and the same FMV cinematic effect, and they both are in 3D.
Even when the tow games are in 3D, Final Fantasy VIII graphics quality surpasses the graphics quality in Final Fantasy VII, because character in Final Fantasy VII looked a little blocky like while they were more realistic in Final Fantasy VIII.
Even if you say that there is a time period between the two games (tow years) and that technology has improved which resulted in the improvement of the graphics in Final Fantasy VIII, I would say to you that it is somewhat impossible because they would at least have to wait two more years to finish the game, but they didn't because the time period was only two years not four which implies that they used the same technology with both of the games, though the only time I would agree with you is when they both are manufactured with two different technologies and of course I'm only talking about the graphics.
Therefore, after all I have said I still don't think that both of them are equally in term of graphics.
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Elc
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 9:52 am Post subject: |
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I, personally, don't really think it's appropriate to make a graphics vs. graphics case when it comes to the games. The quality of the graphics are, of course, factors dependent upon the power of the hardware and the knowledge of such hardware by the programmers. Had both Final Fantasy VII and Final Fantasy VIII been released exactly as they are, but in reverse order, then one could say the graphics are bad. A fairer comparison would be to say the regular sprite models are lacking after seeing the in-battle sprites.
Considering Final Fantasy VII was Square's first game on the PlayStation, it's natural that they wouldn't be able to take full advantage of the new hardware. Then, though the process of developing Final Fantasy VII, the developers would have learned how to use more of the system's potential, resulting in what we saw in Final Fantasy VIII. But, all in all, the quality of graphics is a very subjective issue, everybody will have differing opinions about it. The Arc the Lad Collection was released on the PSX following the release of Final Fantasy X on the PS2 and the graphical presentation is primarily 2D sprites, and I my decision to buy it was based partly on how they looked.
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Maken
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 11:14 am Post subject: |
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Umm... I voted for FFVII becuase it has a lot of good characters, and a good story even when it has a somewhat bad ending :) .
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Samurai X
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 5:55 pm Post subject: |
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There seems to be decent discussion right now, so this versus topic can stay open. However, if this degenerates, you guys know what'll happen.
Anyway, neither of them particularly stood out. Both had a mediocre storyline, terrible characters, even more terrible villains, and shoddy gameplay. But, since I have to pick, I'll go with VIII and its slightly more tolerable battle system and better music.
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Lebenegal, thats quite a review of VII. I can agree with you on VIII, because once I picked the game up I put it right back down.
However, I'm curious what do you define as a good character, storyline etc? Now I will be the first to admit I have not played that many RPG's and so there are probably many good games out there that I have never played. But FFVII was one of the best games I have ever played. Contrary to your opinion, I believe FFVII had some of the best characters, villains, storyline and such. Even in recent times I have gone back and played it because it was such a good game. I'm just curious to know why some people dont like it. Most of the reasons I hear that is overrated, but any popular game will be overrated to someone. Its the reasons why its overrated I never hear. ( I do not think FFVIII is overrated, I just got very bored with it)
Whats wrong with the battle system? I found it was fairly easy to manage and is one my favorites, if not the favorite. I had a blast leveling up materia farther into the game, especially Knights of the Round. The battles did not take that long of a time but they weren't too short either. I can't find anything wrong that would make it terrible.
Storyline is great also. I guess it could seem confusing at times but Square did a great job on this.(Wish I could say the same about the FF's after VII) The storyline actually makes you think which is a good ingredient for a good storyline. There's a lot of confusion over who the main villian in the game is and whose controlling who etc. Of course, no one should believe all those "theories" out there and wait until Square release all the movies,sequels and prequels. VII's plot is as good as any other game out there. (Someone prove me wrong, I need some good games to play.)
Maybe, If I ever get the time I'll go back and play FFVIII. However, I doubt that will ever happen. VII beats in VIII in every aspect there is, story, characters, etc. |
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Aurelien
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 6:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Samurai X wrote: |
| I need some good games to play. |
Play Final Fantasy IX, it's way better than Final Fantasy VII. At least, in my opinion it is.
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Elc
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| Posted: Thu Nov 04, 2004 12:28 am Post subject: |
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My first experience with both Final Fantasy VII and Final Fantasy VIII was with the PC version, since I did not have a Sony console at the time they were released. I was still a Nintendo loyalist in those days, while my allegiance has since shifted to Sony while still supporting Nintendo when a game interests me.
That being said, I had a much different experience with the games than if I had played them on the PlayStation. It didn't help that my computer had about half the recommended RAM (I don't think I realized this at the time, though I eventually discovered that the store I had upgraded the computer at had inadvertantly neglected to upgrade the RAM properly - the only gave me half. But, when I called it to their attention, I immediately got the rest without a problem.) and every battle seemed to take forever. Summons were a nightmare, and could have easily been bathroom breaks, but I persevered.
I can't really explain why, but I had a better experience with Final Fantasy VII, perhaps because I liked the setting much more than that of Final Fantasy VIII. I don't really like saying "this game is better than this game" since I tend to find something I like in each game... most of the time, anyway. I must disagree that music should take a backseat to the story in an RPG, that's just personal opinion, because if the soundtrack is annoying, you're not going to have a great overall experience. There's always the option to simply mute the volume and listen to something else, but that takes away a lot of the game's ambience. A good soundtrack is not only appealing, but it should help establish and maintain the mood of the story. Imagine, if you will, battling Sephiroth or the various forms of Jenova with a circus theme soundtrack. Doesn't sound appealing or appropriate, does it? Then again, I find the soundtrack to be a very important ingredient in anything.
Samurai X, I would also like to know the reasoning behind the overrated comments. All too often people will claim something (I'm not referencing anyone here, just for the record) and repeatedly fail to provide proof or reasoning when called on their claim. That has always annoyed me when participating in group discussions online, people will say someone did an interview online and came across as an arrogant jerk, but are then unable to provide a link or even a transcript of the interview. But, despite that, the argument is used over and over again as to why the person in question should be villified. The only reason I believe I have seen for people saying Final Fantasy VII is overrated is because it was many peoples' first RPG and, thus, they shower it with praise, while people who have played many of the previous games see it differently.
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Aurelien
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| Posted: Thu Nov 04, 2004 7:28 am Post subject: |
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| I must disagree that music should take a backseat to the story in an RPG, that's just personal opinion, because if the soundtrack is annoying, you're not going to have a great overall experience. |
I realize that it's your opinion, but what you mentioned just now is indeed supporting the idea of music being a minor point of an RPG. You said that if the soundtrack is annoying, you're not going to have a great overall experience. It's true, but would you say that the game itself is a bad game just because it has an annoying soundtrack? I honestly doubt so.
Like I've mentioned before, when people play a game, they don't play the game to listen to the music. While I admit that music plays a part, I strongly disagree that it plays a major role. Especially compared to the story, characters, and battle system.
Story is the backbone of an RPG. If a story failed to grasp the players' attention, they won't bother to play the game. Characters are important because we interact in the game through the characters, without good characters, people wouldn't really care of what happened to them. Battle system is important IMO because battle system (in most, if not all, RPG) is how the players try to build up their characters and most likely it would happen throughout the game. If a game has an annoying battle system, people could be annoyed enough to stop playing the game.
To me, that's why I consider those three parts to be the major parts of RPG games. While music, graphics, translation, and other stuffs also affect how good an RPG is, being alone wouldn't really affect an RPG unless it's really *that* awful (like a happy song playing in a sad scene).
A game with below par storyline/character/battlesystem and excellent music would most likely make people finish the game once just for the sake of doing it and never bothered to play the game again (though they might buy the soundtrack). But a game with annoying music and great storyline might make someone be a fan of the game and replay it numerous times.
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