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Final Fantasy XII
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Pepe




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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I agree with a large portion of the forum here in that Square-Enix has been crap for some time...I loved VI, Tactics, VII, and thoroughly enjoyed VIII and IX, suprisingly, but DESPISED X, and didn't even try XI or X-2 out of disgust

I'm moderately amped for this game, but I'm not holding my breath...I'm looking forward more to the FFVII projects that Square has lined up.
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Zero

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

That's all speculation and rumor, I really wish the rumor would die. As of right now there are NO FFVII projects under way, if you can show me a reliable source that says otherwise I'll be supprised. Square has said that they would like to make a remake for the PS3, but it's not a priority at the moment. I think the hype is to blame for this, after Advent Children was released a whole new swarm of rumors were too, all of the enthusiests want the game remade but for the most part it's just being over hyped.

As for XII, after looking at the trailers I think you can expect a Grandia type fighting system (it didn't look like a ABT) and another real flamboyant main character. At least that's what I gathered from watching the trailer, for those of you that hated X I'm thinking that more than likely you'll hate square for a few more years because unfortunately a lot of people liked ten, and a lot of people are glad to have a break from the typical main character that's so over done in every game.
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Parallax

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Quite frankly...I doubt I'll even pick up a copy of Final Fantasy XII unless I hear significant praise from people who's opinions I respect and trust. In my opinion, everything Square has made since Final Fantasy VIII has been a step downhill. I thought Final Fantasy IX was awful. I thought X was too short, and too linear, and not much of an improvement on IX (although I did like X better). FFX-2 had too little variety insofar as characters go, with only three playables, which really annoyed me. Plus I just plain can't stand Yuna.

Changes in the combat system are fine, I guess...although I really hate some of the new directions other RPGs have gone. Suikoden IV's combat system was a significant step backwards for me over the system of III (although I hated the 'pairs' in three...)...with only four characters, streamlined commands, and getting rid of the skill system from III. I couldn't stand Star Ocean: Til the End of Time's system. After about ten minutes of playing, I gave up, and never touched the game again.

Still, a combat system does not make an RPG game. I didn't see anything wrong with the systems in Final Fantasy IX, X, or X-2, but I didn't like any of the three games. My distaste for them had to do with characters, music, and storyline. Compared to other games in the series, nothing about IX, X, or X-2 struck me as memorable in the music department. The characters, while not bad, were also not as memorable/enjoyable for me as the ones in previous games (especially VI, and VIII). IX, X, and X-2 suffered from weak villains, and inadequate attention paid to fleshing the storyline out. As much as I hate Sephiroth, he was a hardcore badass when strung up along the likes of Seymour and Kujah.

Bottom line: Square has failed to impress me with anything they've released for the better part of a decade. I won't be spending money on any of Square Enix's titles until that situation changes.
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Himuro

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I personally loved FFX-2. The gameplay in that game was amazing.

Pepe wrote:
I agree with a large portion of the forum here in that Square-Enix has been crap for some time...I loved VI, Tactics, VII, and thoroughly enjoyed VIII and IX, suprisingly, but DESPISED X, and didn't even try XI or X-2 out of disgust

I'm moderately amped for this game, but I'm not holding my breath...I'm looking forward more to the FFVII projects that Square has lined up.


How can you agree that Square's been crap and then admit that you're interested in all the FFVII cash ins? Does not compute.

Zero what the heck are you talking about? Have you heard of FFVII: Advent Children? Crisis Core? Dirge of Cerberus? Before Crisis? That's the FFVII projects he was talking about.

Everything Square has made Parallax? Including Vagrant Story? Final Fantasy Tactics? Xenogears? Einhander? Bushido Blade?

Quote:
Still, a combat system does not make an RPG game.


It helps define one. It's what you're doing 90% of the games...and believe it or not, turn based and random battles turn some people off. There's nothing wrong with broadening your audience.

Quote:
IX, X, and X-2 suffered from weak villains, and inadequate attention paid to fleshing the storyline out.


Like VII and VIII? FFVII suffered from a rushed second half and FFVIII suffered from a couple of plot holes, just like IX and X. I don't see why they'd get excluded.
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Zero

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Himuro wrote:


Zero what the heck are you talking about? Have you heard of FFVII: Advent Children? Crisis Core? Dirge of Cerberus? Before Crisis? That's the FFVII projects he was talking about.


I've heard quite a lot of people lately babbling on and on about how they're going to make sequels to the FFVII game, I had misunderstood and assumed that he was talking about that, as opposed to the more or less, hour long FMV's.
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Himuro

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Dirge of Cerberus can be considered a sequel to FFVII since it's after it I guess.
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Dooz

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Zero wrote:
That's a common misconception, Dooz. Talking about how bad FFX is, I mean. For some reason people view it a bit more narrow minded than square intended, or at least that's what I believe. It was an obvious attempt at introducing a new type of main character that doesn't play the part of a the solumn loner that has to save the world. Tidus wears his heart on his sleeve and has no qualms about speaking his mind. This makes him both lively, and I think refreshing to watch. No other FF game had a main character even similar to him, and I think it was an innovative idea lost on a crowd that WANTED another typical loner to save the world. Square did a find job, and I'm fairly sure that after X and X-2 they've realized that people want their stray loner back. If they haven't then they'll probably make a mistake in releasing the game.

I hated FFX because I thought the characters were lame (All of them) and I thought the story was boring.

You're right when you say that no other FF game had a character like Tidus. But he is different in a bad way. In the "Wow lame" way.

Now I'm all for new things. New ideas, and new personalities. But just because it's new doesn't mean it's good. No one would enjoy the game if the main character was a broom handle. BUT HEY IT'S NEW WOWOWOWOWOW! :roll:

The Hot Ice wrote:
How could you not have enjoyed IX and X? Both of them were gems of games that tried to differentiate thhemselves from the uber-popular VII, and I think they did well, and I like both games about equally, though VII is still better.

I did not like X because of some of the reasons stated above, and I did not like IX also because of the characters and story. I did not find them interesting, thus it bored me, and I never finished the game. Actually, I liked the characters even less. So there wasn't a reason to continue playing.
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daoster




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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 11:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Square rarely disappoints me, so I'm definately looking forward to FFXII.

Though I kinda hope that Matsuno doesn't stick to his usual themes, such as the evil govt, or evil church deal, and all the backstabs (but it looks like the evil govt. part at least will be part of the story).

The battle system looks a lot like FFXI's battle system, which is AOK with me, since I enjoyed FFXI's battle system.
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Parallax

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Himuro wrote:

Everything Square has made Parallax? Including Vagrant Story? Final Fantasy Tactics? Xenogears? Einhander? Bushido Blade?


No. There are Square games I like, just nothing that they've released since the PS2, and for some time before its release as well. I liked Final Fantasty Tactics and Xenogears quite a bit, but I was seriously disenchanted with much of their other recent releases.

Quote:

It helps define one. It's what you're doing 90% of the games...and believe it or not, turn based and random battles turn some people off. There's nothing wrong with broadening your audience.


I find endless combats to be incredibly boring in most cases. I preferred Xenogears, where you did not spend 90% of your time fighting, it's one of my favourite RPGs, hands-down. Exceptions include Final Fantasy Tactics, because I like the strategy-fighting system...but that's not exactly a traditional RPG.

Anyway, my point here was (perhaps badly illustrated, but anyway) that regardless of how cool/not cool a combat system is, what makes an RPG for me is the story, the characters, and the music more than the actual gameplay. You are correct, however, that there is nothing wrong with trying to broaden the scope of your audience, especially with a monolithic money-garnering franchise like Final Fantasy.

Quote:

Like VII and VIII? FFVII suffered from a rushed second half and FFVIII suffered from a couple of plot holes, just like IX and X. I don't see why they'd get excluded.


I didn't include them because they're earlier works, and my primary concern was with their more recent games. I liked Final Fantasy VIII quite a bit, I liked the characters in particular in VIII, but you're right, it did have a few plot holes. I liked very little about VII, in which I seem to be a significant minority. If I want to talk about Square's entire catalogue, then most of my favourite games of theirs will all be SNES games.

Anyway...I probably forgot something. >.> Feel free to point out any flaws in my thinking. :)
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Zero

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

It's hard to point out a flaw in someone's opinion, since it is their opinion.

Furthermore, I believe quite whole heartidly most people detested X subliminally because it didn't put you in the pivical role of changing the world while looking as bada$$ as possible. Despite what everyone says, the characters were not that bad, they were actually well depicted, and even though I'm not a fan of playing the slightly less fun heart on their sleeve characters, I STILL found the idea behind the game its self rather unique.

The music was good, the gameplay was not clunky and the combat was for the most part quick. That's why I liked it, they made random battles rather easy to get over with, and unlike VIII you didn't have the option of not leveling up to keep your enemies weak. It had many of the same traits of FFVII really, it was simply lacking two guys with abnormally large swords. I'm not heartbroken, but apparently the lack of pure action is what drove most people away. No matter how many lame excuses are presented, typically that's the issue, and it shows up rather clearly when the games liked are presented, seeing as how they all follow a specific suit.
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Dooz

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2005 1:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Well, Zero, you're right when you say it's hard to point out a flaw in somone's opinion, because it is indeed their opinion. But why are you trying to do just that immediately after saying such a thing?
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2005 6:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I got my hands on the demo today (Thanks to DQVIII :3), and I must say, I am impressed. Combat is very different, and it's largly reminicent of my days on FF XI.

For those who don't have the demo, I'll explain as best I can. You're put on a battlefield with a certain objective to clear before you take on a boss, and monsters roam the landscape. When you get close enough to an enemy, you may choose to attack it via the classical menu. Afterwards, your characters move into place and attack the monster. In the demo, the character's will physically attack by default, and you'll have to manually cast spells for each individual (aside from healing spells, they'll do that automatically), but when the full version comes out, you can customize the party's AI to suit your needs. After the monster drops, Exp is given out, and sometimes they drop an item. Monsters are also categorized into different groups: Aggressive, Passive, and Linking. Aggressive monsters will attack you if they see you, while passive and linking will only do so if they are attacked first. Linking monsters will also enter combat if it is nearby a battle already taking place.

I'm looking forward to the final release next year. :3
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Zero

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2005 9:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Dooz wrote:
Well, Zero, you're right when you say it's hard to point out a flaw in somone's opinion, because it is indeed their opinion. But why are you trying to do just that immediately after saying such a thing?


It's not a flaw, it's more specifically called undertones. It's easy to see when someone is controdicting themselves.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2005 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I do not make the mistake of judging any final fantasy on the ones preceding it because each one is its own separate story with a separate system. Saying "FFXII will be bad because I dislike FFX." is an irrelevant statement. Any speak of how you feel about FFX is completely not on the topic of FFXII. Saying you plan on not playing FFXII because from what you see of the game, you aren't impressed, is valid.

From what I have seen, which isn't a whole lot, I can not make a full assumption, but at this point I do plan on picking it up. From what I have seen, there are a lot of cool features and listening to Raze's little DQ8 Demo description, I'm looking forward to seeing it.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 17, 2005 12:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Zero wrote:
Dooz wrote:
Well, Zero, you're right when you say it's hard to point out a flaw in somone's opinion, because it is indeed their opinion. But why are you trying to do just that immediately after saying such a thing?


It's not a flaw, it's more specifically called undertones. It's easy to see when someone is controdicting themselves.

What the hell are you talking about; you're acting as if your opinion is indeed truth. You're saying that they AREN'T bad characters. Belive it or not, but that was you expressing your opinion. So what right do you have to tell someone else that you shouldn't be pointing out flaws in other people's opinions? You just did! You're saying that they are flawed in thinking that the characters are bad!

So, please, get over yourself.
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