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11 year old mommy
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Ninjar

The Shins


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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2006 2:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

UberYuber wrote:
Quote:

morality is determined by an individual, but it will always be compared to one's own moral code.


That's true. The point is that if the mother is raising her child to abide by her morals then there really isn't any reason to call her a bad mother. Perhaps she's misguided by many of society's standards, but as long as she's raising the child to believe in what is right and wrong as she sees it, then she's only doing as right as she can. No?.


I say that she is a bad mother because she is, in fact, a bad mother. If she were doing her job and watching out for her daughter, she would have had some idea about her child's actions. However, I am inclined to wonder whether there is a father in this equation. The reason I say this is because there is no mention of a father in the article. This would, to me, be instrumental in how I judged the mother. First of all, I would say that if she were a single mother, the job would be much more difficult. Also, her ability to watch her daughter at that time would have been severly limited due to her having a new child in the equation. Having said that, it sounded as though the girl had several siblings that she looked after. Not to say anything of the mother, but it sounded like the girl had a lot of responsibility placed upon her. She made mention of the fact that she didn't enjoy bathing them. This leads me to think that her responsibilities regarding the children went much further than anyone should expect of a child. These very things lead me to believe that she sought out activities that were more adult oriented in order to 'fit the part' this is merely speculation, but I believe that she was driven to smoking and drinking, in part, through the responsibilities that her mother placed upon her. If her mother set all these things on her, one would wonder what the hell the mother was doing with all her time. Could it be that she learned that grown ups smoke, drink, and have sex with one another casually from her mom and she just wanted to fit into the description of what a grown up does. Perhaps that it was indeed the moral code that was given to her from her mother.

I am inclined to believe that her mother failed to teach the proper lessons.
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AA

Spears of the Sand


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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2006 5:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Ah mr Ninjar you raise an excellent point.

So could it be that the Mother has been going out boogying all night long and left her eldest daughter in charge of the children, if so we suddenly see this in a different light. Prehaps the little girl though that she was an adult, so could go around doing adult things and her miss education on the facts of life is what has gotten her into trouble.

Her mother was too busy partying and making babies all the time to watch her daughters progression and in turn has failed her daughter as a parent.

The child is just following the example of her parent, which begs the question. If these are the parent morals and the girl has picked them up and folowed them does this make the mother a good parent?
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Sierra Mikain

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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2006 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Kiddo wrote:

look down on them? where do you get this from?


Dood I talk to you every day. Not to mention... yesterday morning and that's exactly what you said. That when you see people with different standards you're "disgusted". I wasn't dwelling on the abortion stuff since that's a whole nudder thing and a whole nudder conversation.

Quote:

i don't think a mother who has what society calls low morals would want her child to follow in those footsteps. society can say "prostitution is immoral". the mother may be a prositute, and be a great mother, yet definatly not want her daughter to end up being a prostitute. why? she doesn't agree with her own moral code?


I don't get what you mean by that. You can't not agree with your own moral code. It's like saying you disagree with your own opinion. Either you're following your morals in your actions, or you're not.

Ninjar wrote:

I say that she is a bad mother because she is, in fact, a bad mother. If she were doing her job and watching out for her daughter, she would have had some idea about her child's actions.


This makes two poor assumptions from what I've read and understand:

1. That she didn't know.
2. That she would see it as wrong if she didn't.

Quote:

I am inclined to believe that her mother failed to teach the proper lessons.


You didn't really add anything to the conversation that hasn't already been said. You're judging this mother based on your opinion just like everyone else. Besides the fact that this was a news story and thus was slanted to make the story as shocking and disturbing as possible, you don't really know the whole story.

Just because a child had to help raise the siblings doesn't mean the mother is a bad mother. There are times when it's not a broken home that the children have to lend a hand to keep things going smoothly. Just look at John Boy from the Waltons. *sings the theme song (yeah there's no words to it)*

Anyways, helping raise siblings could have either a good or a bad effect on a child. It could lead them to mature at an earlier age or it could cause them to think they're mature at an earlier age. I think it's obvious, if anything, the child seems the latter, but it could also be the former. The problem could be that she's hitting her teen angst at 10 instead of years later.

Quote:

If her mother set all these things on her, one would wonder what the hell the mother was doing with all her time. Could it be that she learned that grown ups smoke, drink, and have sex with one another casually from her mom and she just wanted to fit into the description of what a grown up does. Perhaps that it was indeed the moral code that was given to her from her mother.


The fact that she thinks drinking, smoking, and casual sex is fine... and whether that is ok... is a matter of moral opinion. And you can't argue it or judge it without being selfish and ignorant. Your morals are your morals and because someone doesn't agree doesn't make them worse or better. That's the point.

Quote:

I am inclined to wonder whether there is a father in this equation.


There is a father. They got divorced 8 months ago I think it said.

BESIDES ALL OF THAT... you're forming your opinion based on speculation. Don't do that. You seem way too smart to do that. If you look past the girl's age just for a moment, just for one second consider that the age is ok, and read the article assuming that she's 21. None of it is really all that absurd besides the fact that she's still smoking with that child inside her. Is it possible that people can think that such activity is ok for someone of that age even if you don't? Yes.

Even Mohammed had a 9 year old wife. There's even mention in Bukhari of a grandmother at the age of 21. Don't even get me started on the Bible. And these were religious people. People you can assume have the highest of morals. Yet what was acceptable back then isn't necessarily acceptable now?

That's not true either. In some parts of the world, women still get married at the age of 8. Is that right or wrong? That'a an OPINION. While I'm against certain opinions, the fact is that so many people think they can classify something as wrong simply because it doesn't follow their own moral code or religious beliefs.

GUESS WHAT! NOT EVERYONE BELIEVES THE SAME THING AS YOU.

The only one who is wrong in such a situation is the one who points the finger and says "what you're doing is wrong." That is a fact.
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sybillious

Ebony Moon Knights


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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2006 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

ok, this is getting nowhere and fast; agree to disagree and DROP IT. thread closed.
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