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Camus the Noble

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 4:40 pm    Post subject: Question about Kahn Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

When Riou and Viktor first meet Kahn in the Cave of the Wind, I recall that Viktor asked him why he didn't just take the Zodiac/Star Dragon Sword for himself and use it to slay Neclord. Kahn says something like, "That wouldn't work," but does he provide any explanation? Is any explanation given later? Or do I have the conversation completely wrong?

I don't suppose anyone would happen to have a script of that encounter or, for that matter, the whole game?
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Buff

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

i believe he said some thing like the sword was not ment for him. or at least i believe he hinted that way. but i find it odd that he was just waiting for them to show up there. wonder how he knew that viktor and riou and group would actually show up there, let alone wonder how he knew the star dragon sword was actually there.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Well, he must have known Viktor used it before to "kill" Neclord back in his castle in Suikoden I.

It may be that he just felt he should use it again, to vanquish Neclord.
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Yvl

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Huh? I just assumed that The Star Dragon Sword wouldn't have chosen him, or something. It was the sword, not him, so to speak.
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Scott

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Somehow, I doubt the Star Dragon sword Would be willing to just let some GUY waltz in and pick him up and start swinging him arund. An' with how..high and mighty the sword is, I can't see it giving Kahn much of a chance to explain before attacking him as it does your party.

Or it could be that Kahn knows he'd suck with a big two handed weapon when he's used to those club looking things that he uses. Or he knew Viktor'd be along anyway and figured it was Vik's place to take down Neclord, again.
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Yvl

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Yeah... that... OR... maybe Kahn IS a vampire!!! o.O

Except that an undead would not come with a holy rune.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I don't think the sword is that picky as to who uses it. When you face the Neclord in Jorth WIndow castle Viktor asks the sword if he should give him to Neclord and the sword says, "Do whatever you like." If the sword is indifferent to being used by a vampire, I doubt it cares who wields it normally.
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eXistence of Fly

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

wataru14 wrote:
I don't think the sword is that picky as to who uses it. When you face the Neclord in Jorth WIndow castle Viktor asks the sword if he should give him to Neclord and the sword says, "Do whatever you like." If the sword is indifferent to being used by a vampire, I doubt it cares who wields it normally.


That can easily tie in with its past though what with Neclord and the night rune, one would think it would have a past with Neclord just as it 'chose' Viktor during the past in Qlon. When Viktor first tells it that Neclord is still alive it does seem to get rather irritated just as it did when Viktor mouthed off to it which actulaly caused the fight in the cave of the wind (since it didnt do squat with Tessai when it was about to shallack his blacksmith)

Since however when you first see the SDS it transports you into the past one would think it has a certain affinity with it, so it could very well have known by Viktors past actions that he wouldnt give him to Neclord hence the indifference.
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Yvl

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Hmm... is there any info on how Edge got the sword in Suikoden 3? That would be useful in this discussion...
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Buff

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 3:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

edge got the sword from viktor. pretty much viktor and flik were travelling and came across the village where edge lived which got attacked by vampires. so they decided to help out, edge told viktor that he wanted to be stronger in order to kill the vampire that kidnapped his sister. so viktor gave edge the star dragon sword and he killed the vampire and got his sister back. after that viktor didn't ask for the sword back and thus edge kept it.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 3:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Kahn said that won't work because he knows he needs the Marley clan secret anti-undead spell(or something like that), which he has, and also the help of Sierra, for some reasons I forgot. Viktor gave Edge the sword because Edge needed a sword and because Viktor was sick of it, I remembered.
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Buff

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 3:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

dude just read my post above and you will see why viktor gave the sword to edge :roll:

as for the sword what you said happened towards the end of the game when they went to tinto. were talking about when you first went to the cave of the wind before you get your castle. and the spell kahn does is a spell that seals vampires souls and is a marley clan secret. sierra comes along just so she can get her blue moon rune back.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I read your post about Edge and Viktor, you stated Edge's view point, I stated Viktor's view point, and agreed with what you provided on Edge's view point. And friend, I admit I misuderstood Camus the Noble's posted question, I took it as why Kahn did not take the sword and just kill Neclord, when he meant to ask why Kahn said it wouldn't work. I know it sounds the same, that's why I got confused, that part was my fault, my mistake, my bad, and I apologize. But regarding Sierra, Kahn approached her for help. And yeah, of course her main motive was to get the rune back, but they were just making use of each other. If Sierra hadn't been there, Neclord would be able to use the blue moon rune, and Kahn and Riou alone wouldn't defeat Neclord that way. But Sierra's appearance quietened the rune. And when I explained it that way I didn't mean in Tinto. I meant that Kahn probably knew he needs not only the sword, the spell, but also sierra. But well, there's a big doubt, I admit.

But again, it's solely based on memory. So again, Buff, feel free to correct me, haha.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

i believe kahn knew that neclord had that rune or at least it seemed like it. he said there was only one person that could help them out and that was sierra. sierra stoped the rune from releasing after neclord tried to use it since after all neclord stole it with out it willinly going with him.

as for what i said on edge, that was not edge's viewpoint, that is official on what actually happened and how edge got the sword from viktor.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 5:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Ok, the point you believe about Kahn coincedes with what I thought this time, more or less, largely. As for Edge, ok, it's the official viewpoint and not Edge's viewpoint. Viktor's viewpoint is then a tidbit.

And now back to the main question, haha.

There were many ideas, rebutts and doubts, and I(more or less)agree with all. Though to interpret what he said, it means he knew it wouldn't work if he took the Star Dragon Sword and tried to use it to slay Neclord.

Two parts to add on to this. Did he mean that the action of him trying to take the Star Dragon Sword wouldn't work; or did he mean that the action of him having the Star Dragon Sword and trying to slay Neclord with it wouldn't work? I interpretted it as the latter idea.

Basically, I've scanned through the posts, and I don't understand eXistence of Fly's post, so pardon me if he had anything that coincedes with this post.
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