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A Suikoden without a True Rune
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Xelinis




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PostPosted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 12:15 am    Post subject: A Suikoden without a True Rune Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

You guys, don't you think it's time we had a mainstream (in other words, not a spin-off like Rhapsodia) Suikoden game that didn't have a True Rune. When asked what Suikoden is about, a lot of people tend to say, "Oh, it's a series about these 27 True Runes and..." I just disagree with that statement.

Yes, the True Runes have played a big part in the series but that's not what it's about. The series is about political strife and people putting aside their differences and uniting to fight for justice in a world dominated by corruption in those who claim to be leading the people to a bright future. Anyone else care to comment?
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Skooboi




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PostPosted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Eh, I love having True Runes. The True Runes themselves represent the theme that the game is trying to convey. It is the center-point of the conflict in every single Suikoden.
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Scarlet Assassin

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 1:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

It could technically work, but it just wouldn't be the same. Tenkai's are supposed to have true runes in my opinion, it ties in with them being so important. If the developers really wanted to save a few true runes to be ambiguous they could always do stories about the past owners of true runes and how the memories of the relationships in those true runes influenced the future users, such as a former holder of the truw wind rune rebelling against everything and trying to destroy the world. They could even take a step further and say that the runes can communicate with one another (as it's been stated that they have their own will, and we've seen the night rune communicate, there's no reason why others can't) and thus they have certain knowledge about the world that only they could reveal to us. I could just see a game set in the future where the true water, fire, and lightning runes all go "not wind again, he's such a troublemaker."
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siefer




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PostPosted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 3:21 am    Post subject: Re: A Suikoden without a True Rune Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Xelinis wrote:
You guys, don't you think it's time we had a mainstream (in other words, not a spin-off like Rhapsodia) Suikoden game that didn't have a True Rune. When asked what Suikoden is about, a lot of people tend to say, "Oh, it's a series about these 27 True Runes and..." I just disagree with that statement.

Yes, the True Runes have played a big part in the series but that's not what it's about. The series is about political strife and people putting aside their differences and uniting to fight for justice in a world dominated by corruption in those who claim to be leading the people to a bright future. Anyone else care to comment?


YES, I would LOVE for this to happen. I think the potential is enormous in a story like this. However, to many fans (and I believe Konami feels the same way) it would go against what defines Suikoden.

So instead of that, wouldn't it be fascinating if the main hero was someone who wasn't a star of destiny who does not acquire a true rune (or a lesser true rune) and instead must battle against someone who is? That would be the ultimate portrayal of "beating" or defining your own destiny rather than being guided by it, something that Luc would have liked.

It would also be interesting if you were given the choice of who to pick, the person who has the 108 stars under him/her, and the person who does not and the game gave you both views of the war (i.e. Suikoden II with more emphasis on Joey's story).

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Thief

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

With three out of five Tenkai stars not having a true rune, I wonder if such a tradition really matters.
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siefer




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PostPosted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Thief wrote:
With three out of five Tenkai stars not having a true rune, I wonder if such a tradition really matters.


Of the 3 you mentioned:

-Hero II/Riou had half of a true rune, and you had the option (even if it was not the "best" ending) to obtain the full true rune.

-Thomas was not the main character of Suikoden III.

-Hero V had what I liked to call a "lesser" true rune, a unique rune that is noticably more powerful/influential than your typical rune.

Still, that isn't what the original poster had in mind, he/she was probably referring to a Suikoden game with NO focus on a true rune at all (all 3 of the above still focused on a true rune).

Konami themselves (at least in one of the Suiko V trailers they released) believe that runes are the basis of the Suikoden series, so the liklihood of a main Suikoden game void of true runes is fairly slim.

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Alkazar

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2006 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Perhaps it's not possible in a main Suikoden game to not have it focused around a True Rune. After all, by taking a True Rune, you pretty much get thrown into the course of history, quickly showing why a character with a True Rune can be a Star of Destiny. However, it also seems that the gatherings of the Stars of Destiny is not possible without a True Rune - the stars seem to be tied, forever and always, to the True Runes, and gather when True Runes takes center stage in history.

I don't think I can honestly see a Suikoden occuring without a True Rune, whether on the player's side, an opposing side, or as a third party in a war.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 7:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

The point of alot of the Suikoden games is that there is pain and suffering because a True Rune is involved. To completely wipe out all mention of True Runes in any future Suikoden games would dumb down the series' uniqueness

You might as well go pick up any other RPG at that point
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AA

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

The game wouldn't have to be completly void of True Runes, but the main character not to have one, nor the 107 other characters, or they could but just not use them (like Luc in Suikoden 1).

You know it could just use the power of the story line to move the game, there are many things that don't involve a True Rune that could keep the 'feel' of a Suikoden game.

The hero could just have a super-rare rune, that is powerful, but not a True Rune, that could keep the gameplay even between the games.
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Djungelurban




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PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Yeah, I agree. Even though they been important in the games so far, I see no reason why a true-rune-less game wouldn't work. In fact, I think it might be refreshing since the runes usually takes up a lot of space in the story that arguebly could be put to better use.
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Djungelurban




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PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

aydas_arrow wrote:
The game wouldn't have to be completly void of True Runes, but the main character not to have one, nor the 107 other characters, or they could but just not use them (like Luc in Suikoden 1).

Or maybe take the FF7 approach ("I've got a materia that's good for nothing"). A rune can be powerful without being destrutive or resurrective. Or maybe influencial is a better word. If I'm allowed to nitpick a little bit (S5 was so good that any suggestion for "improvement" could be classified as nitpicky), the whole "my true rune can beat up your true rune" thing is starting to bore me a little bit. Give us something new...
..
..
..
And back with the grey scale. The grey-scalier the better. And no silent protagonist... Then I'm probably as satisfied as can be without actually getting the Succession War. Even though Trinity Sight wouldn't hurt.
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Noah

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Nadistu wrote:
The point of alot of the Suikoden games is that there is pain and suffering because a True Rune is involved. To completely wipe out all mention of True Runes in any future Suikoden games would dumb down the series' uniqueness

You might as well go pick up any other RPG at that point


Huh huh... except Legend of Dragoon, I don't think anyone should play that one.

And uh... true runes... I too believe that a suikoden game without the presence of a true rune would be cheapened to the point of... say... a designer knock-off handbag... the kind Gremio carries around with him.
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Nameless Wanderer

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

If you take out the True Rune in the conflicts that exist within the world of Suikoden, you'll just have another simple war.

Also, the fact that the Stars of Destiny only come out to join each other when a True Rune is involved in a major conflict is something which people should put into their calculations when thinking about a True Rune-less Suikoden.

The Stars of Destiny don't just gather for the sake of gathering. They gather for the sake of trying to stabilize a True Rune's proper form. (Words taken from Leknaat. From what Suikoden game, guess. heh)

So basically, my take on this topic is:

No True Rune in a conflict = 108 SOD won't gather = not main Suikoden game
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Naw, man I couldn't play a game without a true Rune. I would boycott it. It would be like playing mario and not jumping, or going to college and not get drunk.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Hmm...a Suikoden game without a True Rune? Actually, in Suikoden II and V, the Tenkai hasn't technically got a True Rune. Unless the Dawn Rune is one, and I just haven't found out about it yet? ( I haven't finished the game yet). In Suikoden II, you've only got half of one, although that might be close enough to count. I wouldn't say that the Tenkai technically has to possess one of the True Runes to make a Suikoden game, though...but it does seem like the game would be hard to make if it weren't centered around some kind of Rune conflict.

In fact, when I played Rhapsodia, I honestly felt there was a little something missing when there was no True Rune that the conflict had some of its basis in. Of course, that may have just been the whole fish-men storyline getting to me, I'm not really certain.

I suppose eventually this will become a serious point of consideration, as there are only so many True Runes in the world, and eventually there won't be any more True Rune stories to tell. That's probably part of the reason why Konami is jumping around with the timeline, in ages past like Suikoden IV, some True Runes might have different bearers, and could play a different role in history than the one that their more modern bearer did. Case in point, Ted's appearance in Suikoden IV. Although Ted does possess the Soul Eater at the start of Suikoden I, he doesn't really do anything with it, besides beat up some ant. In Suikoden IV, you get much more of a sense of what his experience with the Soul Eater was like.

In Rhapsodia, again, you see the Rune of Punishment on Steele and then Brandeau before it ever got into the Commander and Lazlo's rather unfortunate hands in the storyline of Suikoden IV. There doesn't, to me, seem to be any immediate need to do away with the concept of a True Rune around which the conflict is centered. Based around the information about True Runes that we've got, it seems like they tend to cause these major conflicts in any case.
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