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Editorial: True Runes and Rockstars
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Vextor




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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 5:39 am    Post subject: Editorial: True Runes and Rockstars Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Article URL--
http://www.suikox.com/ed/rockstar60204.php

Please discuss the article here. I am interested in feedback, especially regarding the following points--

1. Do you like to see more articles like this that make outlandish claims?

2. What did you like/dislike about the article?

3. Did the article make you laugh? why/why not?
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Zaj I mean Mike

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 6:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

First you puy Feb. 5th it is only the 4th or are you in Japan or some were else that is a day ahead of me?
I was luke-warm to the article what a liked and hated about it was the same thing it was totaly ludacis :D How long did this take you did some one same Yuber looks like a rock star and an idea poped into your head? Although you made very obscure referinces it was funny but you missed the part in the Luc-Maynard James Keenan part. Maynard James Keenan played in the band Tool and A Perfect Circle "Perfect Circle" you could have tied that in with the Cirlce Rune.
But it was an okay artilce I'm just happy that you started putting these up again it had been a while.
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John Layfield

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

The article was written by Ice, not Sars.

Anyway, to the points!

1. Yes, of course. It is really the site's brief after all, is it not? Taggart the Highlander? Dwarf Chief the Imperial? True Runes inspired by rock stars? It all meshes together well.

2. I generally found little wrong with the article. I will say despite the fact that I'd like to see more such outlandish articles that it didn't really engage my interest. This is not a result of any flaw on the author's part but due to my own lack of interest in the music scene, as it were.

3. It raised a smirk or two. As mentioned above popular, or even cult, music isn't my thing so I can't be expected to 'get' all the references and humour but even still I found it an enjoyabale article to read which must mean it's doing something right.
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Acheron

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

It all seems coincidental. The parallels could have been made with anything and I didn't get convinced in any way that the characters you pointed out were modeled after those real rock stars you pointed out. If you were using more well known rockers than I might have been swayed but I've never even heard of the lead singer of Perfect Circle, though I've heard of the band. If you were using people like James Brown, Elvis, Jimi Hendrix, Elton John or other music super stars that are immortalized forever, than your argument would have swayed me. Regardless, the points you brought up weren't correlative enough, in my opinion.

The substance didn't convince me but your style was good. It was well structured and had clear begining, middle and end without having to say things like "in conclusion". Good job with the writing.
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sybillious

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

the coincidences seem way too vague to make a realistic tie; the comparisons were, to say, rather unique, but accurate? that falls under eye of the beholder, i'm thinking.

i have to say that it was interesting; didn't take any fanboy/girlish routes along the way, so that was a really pleasing aspect.
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Monster Hands




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PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 1:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

"Eulogy" is about Kurt Cobain, not God. Maynard had a dislike of Kurt Cobain and never bothered to hide that fact. He was pretty iconic for no real reason and all he did was pretty much complain about everything. Maynard was openly mocking Nirvana fans and basically telling them "hey, this guy had everything going, yet he chose to complain about it, put himself on a pedestal and then blow his brains out"...

"Opiate" is pretty much being forced into a religion and pointing at religious hippocrites who follow blindly and don't question.

"jimmy"(notice that the song name is a lower-case j) is simply about Maynard as a child...his parents were both big religious people...and it's part of why he speaks alot about religion.

Maynard has said many times he doesn't have an issue with God. He has an issue with people who blindly follow religions and just religion in general. The "Lateralus" album very spiritually driven...especially Parabol/Parabola. In fact, it was almost totally blow the Luc/Maynard theory as Maynard talks many times about wanting to experience life and change(such as "Forty-Six and 2" and want to know our level of evolution)

"Parabola"
We barely remember who or what came before this precious moment,
We are choosing to be here right now. Hold on, stay inside
This holy reality, this holy experience.
Choosing to be here in

This body. This body holding me. Be my reminder here that I am not alone in
This body, this body holding me, feeling eternal
All this pain is an illusion.

Alive, I

In this holy reality, in this holy experience. Choosing to be here in

This body. This body holding me. Be my reminder here that I am not alone in
This body, this body holding me, feeling eternal
All this pain is an illusion.

Twirling round with this familiar parable.
Spinning, weaving round each new experience.
Recognize this as a holy gift and celebrate this chance to be alive and breathing.

This body holding me reminds me of my own mortality.
Embrace this moment. Remember. We are eternal.
All this pain is an illusion.


BTW, since when was The Who R&B?
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Alseid

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Didn't like it.

Paralels like that could be drawn for just about anything, historical figures, characters from other fictional works, celebrities... Hell, i don't meant to offend, but i think a better comparison could have been done with the Carebears (no, i'm not gonna elaborate on that *shudders*)

There were some inaccuracies, like Monster Hands pointed.

Honestly, it felt like the author was grasping at straws for something to write about.

Sorry.
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Camus the Noble

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

1. Yes, I would. It was the Speculation Shelter that brought me to this site, after all. Silly articles are lots of fun to read.

On the other side, I would also like to see more "serious" articles, like the one about Makai's motives. However, given the slow rate at which editorials are produced here, it seems unlikely that we'll get many more of both. If I had to choose, I'd goe with the serious ones.

2. No, I did not like this particular article. First of all, I know very little about rock and roll, so the subject material was unfamiliar to me. Second, the cases seemed a bit weak, as stated above. The Sierra-Keith Moon connection was nonexistent, and it appears from the above posts that the second one has serious accuracy issues.

3. No, I did not laugh. I didn't find it humorous.
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Axiose

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I liked it a lot. Ice obviously meant it more in humour than he did in seriousness. The similarities are vague but no more so than the theories on the site already.

1. Do you like to see more articles like this that make outlandish claims?

Yes as it adds a further level of humour to a message board heavy with political dynamics.

2. What did you like/dislike about the article?
I thought perhaps it was too short and that the similarities could've been "forced" more in jest. That are make some more visual arts by merging images over photoshop to get your point across.

3. Did the article make you laugh? why/why not?

Not laugh but it made me smile.

One minor point though...

Quote:
Hugo - Why are you doing this?
Luc - ...
Albert - You wish to destroy God, is that it, killer priest?
Luc - Exactly


I thought it was Caeser who said that outside Brass castle, not Albert.
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Calupict

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 05, 2006 10:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

1. Do you like to see more articles like this that make outlandish claims?
Yes of course. This is speculation site, right.

2. What did you like/dislike about the article?
I like trhe humor. Unfortunately from those rockstars, I only know about Axl Rose.

3. Did the article make you laugh? why/why not?
Yes. It's hillarious. I love this.
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fuji




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PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 12:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Quote:
1. Do you like to see more articles like this that make outlandish claims?


Yes, that's why I originally joined the forums. Because of the outlandish claims that I found quite funny. Keep them up!

Quote:
2. What did you like/dislike about the article?


The article was well written from a technical standpoint. It led the reader through the points the author wanted to make and used proofs to back it up. I believe the author did a pretty good job on that aspect of the editorial and got their point across.

I disliked that it seemed the author was reaching in their attempts, or forcing the examples to show parallels. It just lacked credible examples and forced them on to the reader. Another thing I disliked was that me, not being a rock fan, didn't really know the singers referenced so the examples had less of an impact on me than others.

I look forward to more from the author. I hope that the author chooses an easier thesis next time. I believe it was the subject matter that held back the editorial from being appreciated more by myself.

Quote:
3. Did the article make you laugh? why/why not?


This article did not make me laugh. It wasn't funny, and that's hard to explain. Humour is something that an editorial like this either is, or isn't. I did not find it funny, why I didn't is hard to explain. How does one explain humour?
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Vincent Chase

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2006 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Whoa, I didn't even know this happened yet!

I actually wrote this sometime around March of 2005, and had forgot about it until recently. I'm very happy and honored that Sars decided to post my work on his site.

Zaj I mean Mike says:
Quote:
Maynard James Keenan played in the band Tool and A Perfect Circle "Perfect Circle" you could have tied that in with the Cirlce Rune.


That's brilliant, and I totally should have put that into my essay. Every time I write something, be it an academic paper or something for fun (like my fanfic located in Harmonia) I can always go back and read it and see the things I would do differently.

I was also originally planning on using Opiate opposed to Eulogy, but felt it was a little too obvious.

First of all, I'd like to thank everyone for reading my work. As Axiose correctly said, I did write it more to get a rise from people and less to analyze some deep issue concerning the Suikoden Series. Your constructive criticism has been great (because I'd rather get legit criticism than have my ass kissed...), and I'll keep it in mind when I decide to do another editorial.
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DocFrance




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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 12:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I thought the supporting evidence was extremely weak and coincidental, and the conclusions he draws from that evidence were contrived.
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AA

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

It seems like he has tried to mould the infomation to fit into his views, and some very flimsy connections, personally i didnt like it very much, however saying that it is very well written. However since when have The Who been an R&B band??
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Admiral Ackbar

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I liked it. Then again, anyone willing to mention Maynard and compare him to anything Suikoden related deserved a tip of the hat (or some lame thing like that). It would have been nicer if it were longer though.

But just a minor point...that line about Luc "wanting to destroy God" wasn't even in the Japanese version. The Japanese versions of Suikoden never make any mention of God. It was just another bit of Suikoden 3 where the translator decided to take liberties and add in whatever he felt like. He takes another liberty when there's an optional scene involving the Zexen Knights at the end where they mention the Devil, which was also not in the Japanese version. Not to mention the Valeria scene from Suikoden 1.

I have to wonder...why the hell do Suikoden translators add mentions of God into the games that were not there in the original?

Off topic, sorry...
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