Suikoden Ugly and Inspirational Karma Oblique Xperience

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Why all the hate towards Jowy?
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Camus the Noble

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 9:43 pm    Post subject: Why all the hate towards Jowy? Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Everywhere I go, I see posts about what a horrible person Jowy Blight was. In my opinion, though, these posts miss the point. Everything Jowy did, he did to promote peace. How can anyone disagree? Let's have a look at a short biography of Jowy Blight.

Jowy was adopted by Marcel Atreides when Marcel married Jowy's mother. He was abused by both his stepfather and his brother. Being raised in such a climate would make many children bullyish and insecure. The fact that Jowy avoided that shows that he possessed strength of character from an early age.

He then enlisted in the Highland Youth Brigade, showing his willingness to defend his country and those important to him, another valuable quality. When the Brigade was slaughtered, however, he fought Highland; his patriotism was not blind.

Along the way, he witnessed the evil of Luca Blight many times, and decided to do whatever necessary to stop him. Here is where Jowy ventures into the realm of morally questinable activity. To get close to Luca, he took it upon himself to assassinate Annabelle, the mayor of Muse. Do I agree with him? No, I do not. But I do not condemn him for it. He did what he thought was the right thing to do. Can any of us do anything more? And the fact remains, the murder of Annabelle allowed for the killing of Luca Blight. Annabelle's death prevented thousands more.

He then again showed his morals during the occupation of Greenhill. By dividing the Muse and Greenhill soldiers, he brought the war closer to an end with an absolute minimum of casualties on both sides.

With Leon Silverberg's help, he finally managed to bring an end to Luca Blight. He placed a wooden amulet filled with fireflies in a tree, and when Luca found and opened it, the resulting light allowed the Dunan Army to locate, corner and kill the evil king.

When the time came, however, Jowy showed that he still retained his humanity. He valued his friendship with Riou enough so that, although they were still enemies, he protected Riou and Nanami on numerous occasions from his more bloodthirsty enemies, such as Rowd and Luca.

After the war was over, Jowy met Riou on a high mountaintop on which they had pledged to meet again. Jowy demanded a duel. Although Riou refused to fight, Jowy's strength was sapped by the power of the Black Sword Rune. He then revealed his motives: he was fighting to duel to bring about his own end, so that the people could unite in hatred of him, the perceived villain. Fortunately, the Bright Shield Rune healed Jowy's body and spirit.

The Dunan Army unified the land, but it could not unify the people; the Higheast Rebellion clearly demostrated just a few years after. Jowy, however fought for a lasting peace, he fought to unify the people by giving them a common enemy -- at the cost of his own life.

Albert Eistein said, "Peace cannot be kept by force; it can only be achieved by understanding." Dunan's peace was achieved and kept by force; it will not last. Had Jowy succeeded, the hearts of both Highlanders and Jowstoners would have united; both camps would have casted Highland as being in the wrong when they looked back on the war. This mutual feeling would have led to acceptance, and eventually, understanding.
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Himuro

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

People hate Jowy?! How is this possible? :( Jowy is my favorite game character ever. what a trooper.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Ditto. Well, not favorate, but I didn't really hate him.. The part where 'he turns heel' so to speak, just shocked me, that's all.. I always strived to get the good ending. Not just so Nanami lived, but so you got back with Jowy again aswell.
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Zaj I mean Mike

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 12:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

He's a prick I'll abondin my friend,kill good people join the guy I hate then cowardly get my friend to kill him marry his sister and take over. Tell every one I want peace then try to make them submet when they are stronger than my. And lead every one in the nation to a bloody war a destroy the capital then run away.


And why the only reason I can see for him wanting to join Luca is to marry Jillia because he always loved her and tought she was hot.In which case he okay :D
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Zaj I mean Mike, thats a rather strange hypothsis but its your opinion and yopu are entitled to it. I have not played suikoden 2 but if it comes out in english on the PSP then i will play it. I have read allot about him and i think he is ok.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

What can I say? I've never liked Jowy. Everything about the guy pisses me off. Pretty much everything Zaj I mean Mike said is how I feel about Jowy. If I wasn't a video game perfectionist, I'd KILL him every chance I'd get. But no, I always want to see the "good" ending.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 3:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I can't say to much about him, because he was doing what he thought was right, and that's what I do, even though I do disagree with the course of actions he took during the game.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Jowy is one of my favorite Suikoden characters! I just really liked his whole betrayal story, and how he gave up so much to bring peace to his home. It was a very sad story, especially if you get the ending where he dies.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I can empathize with Jowy up to a point, but once Luca is killed and you get to the Hilltop COnference thing with Leon and Pilika, Jowy goes down in my book. There was no need to bring things to that level. A peace treaty could have been signed.

"New evidence" revealing Luca's treachery in the Unicorn Brigade massacre could have been "found" and the defeated Highlanders could be rallied behing hatrred of Luca. A freidnly and neutral peace treaty, I think, could have been forged without a unilateral surrender by one side. The war was being acused by one man. That man is dead. The war is over.

That whole "the world is not black and white" excuse is such a copout in my mind. THe world is what you make it and Riou and Jowy could have made the world the right way peacefully. The only thing I could say fopr Jowy's actions is that they allowed for Tinto and Matilda to be brought into the fold. If the war had ended and Dunan had restructured, Gorudo would have had a lot of explaining to do. Matilda would probably not be allowed in the Dunan Republic unless he stepped down. Tinto would have become independent (which it did anyway).

As much as I empathize with understand his actions leading to Luca's death, I can;t support him afterwards.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

jowy is my favorite character in the suikoden series and i haven't liked any character as him he is the best
well he is so wise and have dreams for the future
his betrayl thing was all of his plan to make peace he is not a bad guy after all
all the player thinks of him as a bad guy but no everybody he good but what happened is that he liked to make peace not riou so he told him to surrunder but in the end after all was ended he saw that he killed a lot of people so he wanted to make an end for all that but thank godness there is the good ending so with the help of leon who was a character in the gate rune wars he managed to do what he wanted( he wanted power to protect pilika like he said in the game) so the black sword rune helped him a lot
so there is no point in hating him
he is my favorite for all this
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Destiny's Warrior

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Zaj I mean Mike wrote:
He's a prick I'll abondin my friend,kill good people join the guy I hate then cowardly get my friend to kill him marry his sister and take over. Tell every one I want peace then try to make them submet when they are stronger than my. And lead every one in the nation to a bloody war a destroy the capital then run away.


Wow thats quite harsh Zaj. I liked Jowy i thought his attitude and story in Suikoden II was amazing. Such a great character.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

ZImM, You have a very one sided veiw on the game. Most of us as players forget to realize that both Riou and Jowy lived in Highland their entire life. They were Highlanders, if anyone is a traitor, it is Riou for fighting his homeland. However, Both Jowy and Riou saw the corruptness of Luca early and wanted to do what it took to stop him.

Riou figured the best way was to form an alliance among the Jowstonians and rise up against Highland. Jowy thought differently. Jowy, being a Highlander, didn't want to see Highland become an evil dictatorship nation that Luca envisioned. So, he decided to take the man down from the inside. Mission complete. Jowy, who was once a youth brigader now, once Luca is killed, becomes King. I'm sure that wasn't in his plans from the beginning. But the cards played in his favor. He still has an entire nation of highlanders who have the wool pulled over their eyes. They all beleived Jowston is an evil land and that they were the ones who were justified in their attacks. So, he had to play into the peoples wants or his people would quickly lose faith. He was placed in a very bad situation once he became king.

We all see the game through Riou's eyes and we never see the whole story through Jowy's. Perhaps if the game had a "Dual Sight System" similar to Suikoden III's Trinity Sight System, We'd understand more about Jowy's plight.

I seriously doubt the motive for his actions was to score with Jillia, again, the cards just fell in his lap and he took advantage.

Personally, I didn't mind Jowy as a character. He was a decent fighter, he had a cool character design and he really made Suikoden II a fun game. Besides, you know that dual attack with Riou was sweet. Especially when they layed the smack down on that fatass Gorudo. Man I wanted to kill him.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Joey isn't a bad character I think. Everything he did he believed in and he was doing it all for the right reasons. Both him and Riou just wanted to end the war. Although he probably could have called a truce after Luca Blight was killed, by this time there were alot of Casualties from the war. It's possible the sides wouldn't want a truce after all that happened, as the state and higland havn't really been friendly towards each other for a long time...

It's still not really a reason to carry on a war, but Joey was still trying to do good so I can't hate him. He has a great rune too!
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I think if he would of just made a treaty with Riou, things would have been fine, but things had to be done his way, even though him and Riou were working towards the same goal, if Jowy really wanted peace.

It just seams really conceited of Jowy to believe that he needed to be in control for things to work.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I never found myself hating Jowy, but rather just wishing he had never defected and gone back to Highland. I can understand what he did because he saw his actions as the only way to get rid of Luca Blight. Hell he was pretty damn smart about it too. He went out and found probably the smartest strategist in Leon and got in good with the princess. Obviously he put a lot of thought in his plan and it almost worked.

He even helped you fight Gorudo (maybe i missed on the spelling) when Nanami was in danger. That in my mind kind of made me say, "Hey he isn't that bad, but just believes that he is going about this the right way."

And in the end of course all is solved and the childhood friends are reunited, assuming of course you accept the good ending. It is a little strange though how two kids who cause so much destruction and chaos in a country can just go skipping off merrily into the sunset, but hey it's a game.
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