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The most powerful being in the world!!!!
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Wataru

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 5:46 pm    Post subject: The most powerful being in the world!!!! Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I was replaying S1 and something struck me as odd. The Suikoverse has never been much for technology (it is, after all a fantasy game), but the instances of technology they do have are simply astounding. Juppo, the throwaway character who is one of the few fat people in the Suikoden series (represent!), has managed to create artificial intelligence! Gadget, the walking talking barrel, is an example of technology we don't even have today. Further tinkering by Meg and Belle has allowed Gadget to equip Runes! Other tehcno-hacks like Kamandol and the all those elevator people are still puzting around with pulleys and oil-burning engines, and this guy has made some kind of advanced computer system that has given rise to a new wholly technological life form! The guy's doing something right.

I think Tricksters are an overlooked part of the Suikoverse. In recent games they've been reduced to squeaky and downright irritating (Rita and Lu), but Juppo has some real power there. This guy could make a robot army and take over the world. With the DEF and MDEF that Gadget has, you can blast him with all the Runes you want and it won't make any difference! Gadget in WarMech for (as seen in the SII ending) frightens even Jeane!

The guy also made a robot security system for Lepant and those things are nasty! S1 players can attest to the path of destruction they cut through low-level parties (they can one-hit-kill Luc no matter what level he is!).

If you ask me, this guy is the most powerful being in the Suikoverse. I would love to see him get some more development in later games, but, alas, I fear he is lost to the history now.
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Onimaru

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

If i'm not mistaken there's an article about this on the SAR..'er...Suikox Site.
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Inko

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Maybe it's not AI but a soul actually infused inside of a Mech, if there is an actual article I'll try to look it up...
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Ryusei

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 7:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I agree with what Wataru said about the tricksters becoming just mere squeaky useless girls. In Suikoden I, the trickster (Juppo) had all the signs of getting more character development in the future. He had a great character personality, and even was pretty decent in battles. I think it's just sad that the most recent tricksters are have just become noisy, irritating characters. I as well would also like to see more character development on the part of the tricksters, most especially Juppo. But if the trend continues on like this, I don't see any hope for the tricksters except for being successful in becoming the one of the (if not the) most irritating characters in each Suikoden game.
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Aurelien

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 7:22 am    Post subject: Re: The most powerful being in the world!!!! Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Wataru wrote:
If you ask me, this guy is the most powerful being in the Suikoverse. I would love to see him get some more development in later games, but, alas, I fear he is lost to the history now.

Well, I think you overlooked runic magic involvement for sure if you label Juppo as the "most powerful being in the Suikoden world". The whole Super Gadget scene at the end of Suikoden II was meant to be comical anyways rather than something serious to be used as a basis to say that Gadget is strong. Let's face it, Gadget is not strong at all.

I'm not even convinced that robots/mechs are all that powerful in Suikoden world. Magic seems to be the way to go with the True Runes.
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Crono

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I agree with Aurelien. I mean, look at Levi, he blasted a hole the size of a town with magic, and he doesn't even hold a true rune (that we know of).

That being said, however, I still do wish to see more of Juppo, he was by far the most intriguing of the trickster characters. His army of mech soldiers were pretty cool too.
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Ujitsuna

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 4:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

It probably took Levi a lot of incantation and/or concentration to make that explosion, and the same might be applicable to Juppo, who knows. It would make for a better explanation, anyway.
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Crono

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Do you mean it might take an equal amount of concentration for Juppo to make his gadgets as it does for a mage to cast a powerful spell? Even so, I would think that magic would always beat out these gadgets in the Suiko world.
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Ujitsuna

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I think what I was trying to say a while ago is that each would take a lot of time, maybe that being the explanation as to why Juppo hasn't built an army and taken over the world or why Levi hasn't made more holes in the planet.

I could be wrong but thats probably the kind of explanation that would get Konami out of a problem. :P
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Onimaru

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I think it's safe to assume that Jupo and his robots were just another oversight by Konami, they were not thinking ahead - they didn't figure that they'd develop such an involved fanbase who question every aspect of the game's, demanding explanations for the how/why the world works. They've tried to backpeddle and explain most of the inconsistances. The easiest explanation for this is that the clockwork robots are finely tuned machines that take a VERY long time to construct, tricksters are apparently goofy looking tinkerers. I personally hated Jupo, and the whole robot thing - it didn't fit in the world, and was obviously put in to add some flavor to the areas of exploration. Not a major plot point.

As for Gadget, well I suppose the easiest explanation for him is that he's a combination of the clockwork robots Jupo initially created - somehow given "life" or "sentience" by runic magic. Is this realy the case? Probably not, again, it's probably not something they thought about - but it'sa good BS explanation. That or he's a little guy in a barrel suite. That's probably more likely.
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Aurelien

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

And again, Gadget is not strong at all. Creating an army full of Gadgets? You know how to beat them? Throw water and screw them up, or smack them just enough to get 1 screw loose. Kaboom! You win against them.
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Onimaru

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Aurelien wrote:
And again, Gadget is not strong at all. Creating an army full of Gadgets? You know how to beat them? Throw water and screw them up, or smack them just enough to get 1 screw loose. Kaboom! You win against them.


True, gadget was a wuss - but the gigaknights that were in Jupo's labyrinth were kind of tough if I remember correctly. btw, remember that bridge in SuikV with the crazy robot monsters in it? what's the deal with that place????
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Ujitsuna

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Onimaru wrote:
Aurelien wrote:
And again, Gadget is not strong at all. Creating an army full of Gadgets? You know how to beat them? Throw water and screw them up, or smack them just enough to get 1 screw loose. Kaboom! You win against them.


True, gadget was a wuss - but the gigaknights that were in Jupo's labyrinth were kind of tough if I remember correctly. btw, remember that bridge in SuikV with the crazy robot monsters in it? what's the deal with that place????


What do you mean? Babbage created those robots to protect the bridge's mechanism so no one would be able to stop the bridge from working. As for Gadget and water, well I suppose, but it's weakness isn't well known. :P
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Milan Fiori

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I don't know about you, but Gadget Z can link up with a freaking Satellite. That's power to me. And the knock a screw loose argument is total bunk. Gadget can go against the Beast Rune Incarnate or True Wind Rune Incarnate and survive. The gadget series robots were made for battle to keep Meg, and then Belle safe while on their journey!
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Crono

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Perhaps the Trick Rune has some sort of power that can give the gadget's life, or at least reasonable intelligence. That seems like an answer Konami would give, anyways.
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