Suikoden Ugly and Illusional Kraalesque Omniscient Xperience

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kuwaizair

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PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2007 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Philosopherking wrote:


I would like to see maybe a game in the suikoden series we were are not specifically tried to be portrayed as the hero of the story but rather the antagonist the oppressor of the people or something like that or maybe thats just the evil voices talking in my head >_>


so like one, where our Hero sails to a forgin land and conqures the people, takes over their land and what not? Like how some say Westren Civilzation was fleshed out on?
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SolemnSound

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PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2007 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

yes the "hero" could sail to a foreign land and conquer it, tht would be a good one or the hero could just stop a rebellion, basically reversing the side that we are on in Suikoden I except of course it would be a different country and scenario.
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Eden

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PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2007 5:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Simply the idea of Suikoden one reversed would be cool. I don't say the story, but the idea, which means next time we are members of the actual government and forces from within and without the nation try a coup d'etat... Don't say we have such a thing in Suikoden V, although that wouldn't be false of course, but I think it would be funnier to stay as head and act from there instead of being the exiles member of the government or Royal Family.
However, due to the similarities between this idea and the last game, I advocate to do this maybe in the seventh installment...
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Rezard




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PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2007 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I prefer Suikoden II reversed, the game begining with your kingdom HQ being take down, you would be like Seed or Culgan, some officer (or lowly soldier) that protects its kingdom, even knowing you already lost, but you somehow miraculous survive and try to rebuild an army to fight against the invaders.

It should be as Suikoden II, your kingdom started the war, you are to be blame for it, your enemy hates you, but you want to save the innocent civilians from your country. No more "we are the nice guys", we are at fault, but we must do something, even if it's only to avenge the death of the royal family.
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TruePerception

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PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2007 4:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

It would be neat to severely get your butt kicked for the first chunk of the game! Take a new angle! And the protecting yourself from what you have sewn part would be cool too!
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Sophita

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PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2007 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I think it would be very hard ofind the hero sympathic if he came to a new land and conquered it. People don't generally like to be ruled by outsiders, and it would be hard to sympathize with a tenkai so greedy. You'd wonder about any citizen of that county really joining him either, as most people aren't too fond of throwing themself under the yoke of possible oppression.
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Onimaru

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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2007 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Well, if anyone here has read George R. R. Martin's - A Song of Ice and Fire series, they'd be familiar with the historical figure of Aegon The Conqueror.

Aegon was a lord from the country of Valayria exiled to the remote and largely unexplored Western continent. Upon arrival there he had a clash w/ the local government, and ended up basically just saying "Screw this...I'm taking over this joint." And thus he united the Western Continent and its warring seven kingdoms into a peaceful (ok, maybe not peaceful) country.

We tend to think of conquering a foreign land as a negative and cruel thing. However it is all dependent upon the Ruler. Let’s not forget that in S2 our hero not only freed the captured Dunan territories, but also invaded and conquered the kingdom of Highland. With a strong enough leader the conquering of a country can be beneficial to the nation: Look at the great achievements of the Greeks, Romans, and Persians who for a time united warring countries and helped to further the cause of civilization.

Do I personally think that a future suikoden will focus on this aspect? No. The nature of the original Water Margin story was about the underdog fighting against an oppressive government, and so far the suikoden series has maintained this focus. A game where the hero is the bad guy is fun in theory, but totally against what the SoD's are about.
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Ujitsuna

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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2007 7:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Sophita wrote:
I think it would be very hard ofind the hero sympathic if he came to a new land and conquered it. People don't generally like to be ruled by outsiders, and it would be hard to sympathize with a tenkai so greedy. You'd wonder about any citizen of that county really joining him either, as most people aren't too fond of throwing themself under the yoke of possible oppression.


He doesn't have to be sympathized with though, he can be evil! Even then the story can easily be manipulated so the hero is on the side of "good." Say for instance the country being invaded could have a very oppressive government and army that just abuse it's citizens day and night, something like that off the top of my head is the kind of thing they'd probably use in such a case.
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Levenheit

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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2007 4:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

you guys are forgetting that tenkai's dont really talk much (except for s3) and are usually victim to circumstances.
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Ujitsuna

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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2007 7:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Being given the choice to do so wouldn't be impossible inside the structure of a traditional Suikoden game though.
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Ryusei

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2007 7:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I'd like to see religion play a part in a future Suikoden game's story some time in the future. I think it would be a nice setting and basis for a war - a war between different beliefs. I don't think it would prove to be quite a hard thing for Konami to do, as religion is obviously present in the Suikoden world. The Theocracy of Nagarea is an example for this. Perhaps Nagarea would be a suitable setting for this type of story.

Also, a conquest might prove to be an interesting basis for a war, too. A nation fighting another nation for conquest sounds interesting. I think it would be doable given the fact that different wars exist in the Suikoden world. A Suikoden game based on a conquest of a nation sounds nice.
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TruePerception

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2007 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

The conquest idea would have to happen in a gaiden or tactics type game, because it wouldn't make sense to gather the 108 stars of destiny to plow over a neighboring country.

Which side would you play in a religious themed Suikoden, the religious or the opposers? While it may work to oppose the theocracy, I don't think a rituous mission would work. Perhaps I'm wrong, though. Any good ideas for a storyline?
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SolemnSound

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2007 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Sophita wrote:
I think it would be very hard ofind the hero sympathic if he came to a new land and conquered it. People don't generally like to be ruled by outsiders, and it would be hard to sympathize with a tenkai so greedy. You'd wonder about any citizen of that county really joining him either, as most people aren't too fond of throwing themself under the yoke of possible oppression.


the tenkai doesnt always have to be a hero. I was suggesting more of a change of pace where you are the villain and you followers would also be evil ones or greedy ones who are only in it for their own self gain. A complete opposite of suikoden games. I would really like that
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TruePerception

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2007 12:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

They make games for that sort of craving, but Suikoden is not one of them! Try Digital Devil Saga (I can't quite remember the japanese part of the name. Shin Megami Tensai?)
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Falcon Critical

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2007 8:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

TruePerception wrote:
Which side would you play in a religious themed Suikoden, the religious or the opposers? While it may work to oppose the theocracy, I don't think a rituous mission would work. Perhaps I'm wrong, though. Any good ideas for a storyline?


What about religious vs religious? That is what most wars in our world are about. "Your gods are different and I can't accept a culture that's not based on theocracy!".

From what I know of the religious wars in Japan there could be potential outcomes such as a coming-together or meeting of religions (as Shinto and Buddhist managed) or the attempted oppression which was fought back against and cleansed from the land (Christianity was introduced and later removed from Japan by force).

I guess the big problem with religious wars in a game is the parallels that people are inevitably going to draw with our history/current political situations. The developers could get in a might of trouble if the story of the game gets too close to Israel/Palistine for example.
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