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Ujitsuna

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 11:32 am    Post subject: The Maximillian Knights... Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Is there ever a reason given as to why The Maximillian Knights had numbered so few by the time of Suikoden III? I know they were getting weaker and less effective by the events of the Dunan Unification War (Suikoden II), but by Suikoden III, theres only two members, and both are inexperienced young fighters - Fred and Rico. Seemed to me around the time of Suikoden V's timeline to Suikoden I's, the knights were doing pretty good with troop members such as Isabel, Mathias, Sancho and Max himself.

Any ideas or little facts no one knows about? Perhaps they all died fighting a dragon. :P
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Raww Le Klueze




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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Weren't they disbanded by Barbarosa prior to the Gate Rune War? Making their numbers dwindle and after II Maximilian retires it disbands again.

15 or so years later Fred starts it again with him and Rico as only members.
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Sniper_Zegai

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I thought they were less efective in Suikoden 2 mainly becuase they were all old men on horses. But still you gotta love max. I wish he was a playable character but alas all he does is sit around the castle.

I guess retirement is the No.1 killer of old people......
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Kalidor

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

The Maximillian Knights are a unit of knights that were founded by Maximillian (the one that we meet in Suikoden I and II) when he was a young man. The Maximillian Knights were almost like a group of mercenaries, except that they would only involve themselves in battles that they thought were just battles, instead of fighting for money. They didn't actually serve as a part of the Scarlet Moon Empire, they were simply based in the region. They would aid the Empire if they thought that battle was one that merited their involvement.

This led to the Maximillian Knights eventually fighting in the original war between Jowstone and Highland, the war in which Han Cunningham and Genkaku were involved in. The Maximillian Knights sided with the side of Jowstone in the conflict. You can imagine that this was not well received by the authorities back home in the Scarlet Moon Empire. When they returned home after the war, the Maximillian Knights were told by order of the Emperor that they must disband their ranks.

What Maximillian did after that isn't known. It can be assumed that he was part of the aristocratic class in the Scarlet Moon Empire, so I'm assuming that he had estates or land interests of some kind that he was able to support himself with. One thing that we know for certain is that he conceived a son at some point, since Fred Maximillian is his grandson. Who his son was or what his name is I don't know. He's probably like the lost Silverberg brother. Nobody really knows what he was all about and only his sons become important.

Anyway, in the Gate Rune War Maximillian joins the Toran Liberation army. When other former members of the Maximillian Knights hear of that they join the Liberation Army too and support Maximillian as a reborn Maximillian Knights. I believe that Maximillian's force was actually quite strong in the Gate Rune Wars.

However, by the time of the Dunan Unification War, Maximillian is a really old guy and so are most of the guys that were in the Maximillian Knights. Most of them were probably dead, so the turn out for this war wasn't as good.

This means that by the time Suikoden III rolls around, the original members of the Maximillian Knights are almost certainly dead. The organisation was only started up by Maximillian, so it didn't have some kind of far reaching legacy or anything, and I suppose that recruitment and membership was not continued. The knights that fought in the Gate Rune War and Dunan Unification War were Maximillian's old colleagues, not new recruits. So, though Fred calls himself the leader of the Maximillian Knights, he would have to form his own group of knights himself if it was ever going to be a bustling organisation again, just like his grandfather did.
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Ujitsuna

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Kalidor wrote:
This led to the Maximillian Knights eventually fighting in the original war between Jowstone and Highland, the war in which Han Cunningham and Genkaku were involved in. The Maximillian Knights sided with the side of Jowstone in the conflict. You can imagine that this was not well received by the authorities back home in the Scarlet Moon Empire. When they returned home after the war, the Maximillian Knights were told by order of the Emperor that they must disband their ranks.


I didn't know about this, where'd you get that information from Kally? This also brings up another question, why did Maximillian decide that Jowston was the side of "good" during those wars? Or was it just because they were losing under the incompetance of Darrel (Mayor of Muse). This means Maximillian fought under Genkaku, and then later went on to fight for his son Riou, thats very interesting...
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Raww Le Klueze




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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Quote:
where'd you get that information from Kally?

There's this site called suikox.com

Maybe you've heard of it?
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Quote:

One thing that we know for certain is that he conceived a son at some point, since Fred Maximillian is his grandson. Who his son was or what his name is I don't know. He's probably like the lost Silverberg brother. Nobody really knows what he was all about and only his sons become important.



Could be that Max had a daughter, who then gave birth to a son Fred.

That may be why there is a gap in the Maxamillian Knights recruitment.

While a women Max Knight is very possible(Suikoden certainly doesn't lack strong female figures) she probably settled for a "normal" life

Its all speculation, but I'm sure had Max fathered a son, he would have followed in his footsteps.
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Ujitsuna

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Thats actually a good theory, I suppose something like that could've happened.

Raww Le Klueze wrote:
There's this site called suikox.com

Maybe you've heard of it?


Nope, never have.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 6:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I have always thought that Max and Sancho were the only members left at the time of the Gate Rune War and that the party Max leads in Suikoden 1 and 2 consisted of generic cavaliers instead of his own men.
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Onimaru

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Why is Max in Toran anyways? Shouldn't he have settled down and re-established the Max knights in Dunan and spent his days dealing w/ that matter. I know they wander far and wide, but did they restablish and are they in full force once again by S3? Just a general quesiton.
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Ujitsuna

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 7:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Onimaru wrote:
Why is Max in Toran anyways? Shouldn't he have settled down and re-established the Max knights in Dunan and spent his days dealing w/ that matter. I know they wander far and wide, but did they restablish and are they in full force once again by S3? Just a general quesiton.


They seemed to be a group of Knights in service to the Scarlet Moon Empire, then once SME started to get corrupted and the Maximilian Knights spoke out against this, the emperor asked/forced them to disband. Perhaps it was more out of loyalty to Barbarossa Rugner that the Knights didn't go to a different country, my opinion is that they waited for a chance to overthrow the emperor though.

In Suikoden III the only members are Fred and Rico. They do however wish to restore the Knights back to their prime.
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John Layfield

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 7:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Onimaru wrote:
Why is Max in Toran anyways? Shouldn't he have settled down and re-established the Max knights in Dunan and spent his days dealing w/ that matter. I know they wander far and wide, but did they restablish and are they in full force once again by S3? Just a general quesiton.


Quite the opposite. By Suikoden III there is only Fred and Rico. Maximillian was the glue that held the organisation together.
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Vextor




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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 7:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Nah, they didn't disband because they "spoke out against the currupt SME." They were disbanded because they helped Jowston during the Jowston-Highland war. They didn't go to another country because they were disbanded, meaning they no longer existed as a group of knights.

At the time of Suikoden 1, many of the original members were still apparently alive, which is why the Maximillian Knights are the strongest "charge" regiment in Suikoden 1. However, by the time of Suikoden 2, most all of them apparently have retired, resulting in the comparitively weaker knights. All of this is actually official information as explained by Konami or one of the developers during interviews.
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Ujitsuna

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Where do you get this information from?! It's like we go on thinking something for years then you just come along and tell us it was all a lie. You need to write a book or something - Suikoden Misconceptions or something.

Why did they fight for Jowston then? The less corrupted side?
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Vextor




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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 8:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

The info has been on this site since at least 2004. I have no idea where you get your info, because I've never heard of that version myself. I get my info from Konami publications available in Japan, most of the time. However, in the case of why the Maximillian Knights were disbanded, you can find this out in the game through Richmond's investigations in Suikoden 2.

As for why the fight for Jowston, there's no official info explaining why. However, you have to assume that Maximillian must have saw them as the "good" side for whatever reason. Of course, his reasoning often lacks... reasoning.

Anyhow, as with most things in Suikoden, official info simply doesn't exist to explain everything, and I'm not in the business to make stuff up either. If info doesn't exist, it simply doesn't. If it does, it does.
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