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the alternitive education

 
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kuwaizair

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 5:50 pm    Post subject: the alternitive education Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I was holding out on posting this, so sit tight and enjoy another kuutastic debate topic.

today's subject is "above and beyond 'Intellegent Designe" wich means we will dicussion some tidbits of alternitive history and the likes and if it shold be "manditory" in classrooms just like learning script writing and the alphabet.

why tell American school children only one "Yankee-centric" view of the civil war? Why tell kids such-and-such civilzation is an alleged 10,000 years old when others belive that the universe is only 6,000.

There are many other sides and stories to everything we know and love, like 'dogs are domesicated wolves", some will debate that (see Nova's "Dogs and more dogs".

there are some who had written books about the Grand Canyon that may exclude the idea of it forming over millions of years of erosion.

does this mean people shold opt to learn this? People make books and websites to teach and preach their side to everything. Should it be in classrooms without chosing to learn these things?
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Yvl

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 6:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Quote:

why tell American school children only one "Yankee-centric" view of the civil war?

They don't. In some southern states, they teach it as "The war of Northern Agression." But indeed, they only teach it one way either way. It's up to the state and the teachers. However, it is unarguably for the best that people believe in that which is fact, anything other than that is propaganda. Plus, having alternate viewpoints on a event which did take place in one certain way will lead to arguements amongst those with different biases. And if people can't stop arguing about the past, they will never move on to the future. Things which have not been proven, however, are still up for discussion.

My friend's botany/zoology teacher had a very powerful reason for why they teach the "scientific" version of things but not the relious version - "You don't go to church and pray to Darwin."

Science and religon are seperate. Religon should not be taught in a science class, that should be a no-brainer. HOWEVER, I do totally support a "Religon Education" class, either as an elective or as a state requirement to graduate high school. THERE you can teach about the different unproven theories of life.

I may make some enemies by saying this, but personally, I believe that most religons are outdated. There are so many things that have been proven by science today that the religous types still deny. I find that ridiculous, as you do not need those disproven myths to believe in your god.
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Eden

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2006 8:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Yvl wrote:
Quote:

why tell American school children only one "Yankee-centric" view of the civil war?

They don't. In some southern states, they teach it as "The war of Northern Agression." But indeed, they only teach it one way either way. It's up to the state and the teachers. However, it is unarguably for the best that people believe in that which is fact, anything other than that is propaganda. Plus, having alternate viewpoints on a event which did take place in one certain way will lead to arguements amongst those with different biases. And if people can't stop arguing about the past, they will never move on to the future. Things which have not been proven, however, are still up for discussion.

My friend's botany/zoology teacher had a very powerful reason for why they teach the "scientific" version of things but not the relious version - "You don't go to church and pray to Darwin."

Science and religon are seperate. Religon should not be taught in a science class, that should be a no-brainer. HOWEVER, I do totally support a "Religon Education" class, either as an elective or as a state requirement to graduate high school. THERE you can teach about the different unproven theories of life.

I may make some enemies by saying this, but personally, I believe that most religons are outdated. There are so many things that have been proven by science today that the religous types still deny. I find that ridiculous, as you do not need those disproven myths to believe in your god.


I don't believe that you can tell the story of events that happened somewhere, some time ago, by only using chronological facts. Oh, of course it is easy to explain when George Washington for example fought where, but that doesn't explain anything important.
You will always have more than one sight on things, because people feel and act based on those emotions. This means that you can look at a battle and see the outcome, because it happened long ago, and you can try to say that one faction was poorly equipped and that is the reason they lost, but there is always a reason why the fought nonetheless, although they should have known this as well.

Okay, I am talking way too much about war, but you can have these experiences in your everyday life as well. You can offer help, because you think it is needed, but the person who needs the help might believe your action is only a proof of your idea of your own superiority and his weakness. Is he wrong? Perhaps, but maybe he sees your real motivation better than you do on yourself.

This leads me (me personally) to religion taught in school. I don't believe that this should happen the way it does too often, that the teacher tries to convince pupils of "the true faith". Religion should be first taught in order to understand human beings more than to understand alien entities.
Religion might even be a oportunity to learn to debate and have arguments on a high level. That is the only true meaning of religion in school that I see.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2006 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I'm against the teaching of Intelligent Design/Creationism in public schools for a very simple reason: the 1st Amendment. As long as public schools are PUBLIC (meaning, being paid for using state/government funding), it must hold true to the 1st Amendment which protects people's rights TO a religion while also protecting others FROM a religion.

I'm not against an elective religious class, as long as the curriculum allows for discussion on multiple religions on a comparative basis and the student elects to take it by his/her own free will. Teaching religious dogma ought to be reserved for religious institutions and for the family.

What gets the bug up my butt is the fact that they want to teach this non-science material in the science class. Whether you personally disagree with the Theory or not, Evolution is 100% true in the scientific community. It is the paradigm which all current science is following. To tell children that there is a debate in the scientific community about evolution is a lie. It's a fact, and it's here to stay.

kuwaizair wrote:
Why tell kids such-and-such civilzation is an alleged 10,000 years old when others belive that the universe is only 6,000.


The earth revolves around the sun, yet that is contradicted in the Bible. How do you present both cases to a classroom holding that each view is true?
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Eden, in America, a teacher preaching his or her religon would get them fired in a second. That's like the number 1 rule in public schools.

Of course, one's reasons for fighting and such are usually complicated, but the actual events which happen should not be mixed up. For example, someone teaching that the Holocaust may never have happened, (I'm looking at you, ahmedjihad!) which is an absoloute lie, is absurd. There's alot of grey area, but there is black and white as well, and it should all be taught as what it is.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 08, 2006 6:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Yvl wrote:
Eden, in America, a teacher preaching his or her religon would get them fired in a second. That's like the number 1 rule in public schools.

Of course, one's reasons for fighting and such are usually complicated, but the actual events which happen should not be mixed up. For example, someone teaching that the Holocaust may never have happened, (I'm looking at you, ahmedjihad!) which is an absoloute lie, is absurd. There's alot of grey area, but there is black and white as well, and it should all be taught as what it is.


Teacher should behave the same way in Germany, but sometimes they are influenced by their religion and/or political view.

Obviously you can't say that the Holocaust didn't happen, although some stupid people try it all day long, but you might find it difficult to see a unique, one-for-everyone-reason.

Terrorising jews wasn't new, but was omnipresent over hundreds of years. Why did Hitler kill all those innocent people? Why were so many people, ordinary at home, did it? Some might truly thought of them as a danger to their life, if not physical than at least of their way of life. Some just liked to hurt, kill and humiliate. Others had no working conscious that told them that following an order to kill human beings is not something honourable and others didn't really see where's the difference in killing soldiers and have colleteral damage and killing civilians firsthand.
Some just wanted to denunciate people in order to gain any possible advantage...

You can't deny the holocaust, but you might find many reasons if you ask a single person instead of an entire society.
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