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What is your Religion?
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kuwaizair

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 22, 2004 1:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

*shrugs* i can apparently offend people even just by writing fiction or keeping quite and not saying anything.
--------------------train of thought 1---------

ah...and about all the other stuff, its called "learning from the masters" I can do basicly nothing in a commuinity and someone has to fool people into thinking I'm such a horrid person.

-------train wreck of tought 2---------

everyone can be offened, even by the stupidist thing, every wonder why you (for those who live in the area) don't see the "taco bell dog" anymore? becasue a mexican breed of dog, shouldn't talk with a mexican accient and sell tacos. Remind me to make a movie about a Russian Wolfhou....I mean Borizoi(sp) who speeks Japanese.

-----------train wreck of thought 3------------
i find it odd when seeminly conflicting religions mingle, its like the fruittearin(sp) eating some leather, or a murderd grape for that matter.

-----train wreck of thought 4--------

there was a girl on LJ a former member of a horrid commnity, she was so sad for her friends because she coun't convert them into her extream religon, she even was saying "i'm sad because when they die they die" somthing like that, some people have a "personal" belief that, without god and embrasing said faith, god won't let you have a soul anymore, when you die, thats it, it dosen't matter how good you were.

------train wrek of thought 5------
on the oppisite note, I saw a scary guy on a tv-anglist kind of show, the scary guy was a murderer...and "as long as he accepts Jeasus as his savior he can go do heaven" major 0_o momment for me folks.


-------------------stuff----------
Wicca, is an earth based religon right? and Incorperates many spirits and she-gods (my febel brain dosne't allow spelling) rights and ritual magic and OMG prayer!
you can worship nature and in nature, many people think god(s) are inate in everyhing, a nice idea if more people held it dear.
I went to a PowWow for stuff and wound up buying my mom a cookbook on native American Cooking, there are some quotes in the book, here is one you may find intersting, don't know how valid it is or who ecactly said it but here we go.

"Lo' the poor Indian! Whose untoutor'd mind sees God in clouds or hears him in the wind."-Essy on man-Pope
---------------------

don't get me wrong, I need to soak in this stuff, I want to write, and write in my own invented religions into my invented world, I want to fabricate my own myths, fables and "historical tales"

----------------------------
If you likes stuff, (i haven't but shuld) you should read the Epic of Gilgamesh, it has a lot of things in it you may find familiuar, this story is very, very very old.
like all things it also involves a special tree, there are always religious trees, because the tree is super symbolic.
-------------------
Quote:


christianity did take the traditions and culture of many other beliefs into its own as a method of surviving and converting. That does not mean the only point to that religion is "converting poor soulless animals so I feel big."


so what does Rabbits and Eggs have to do with the real easter? and where did the word come from?

why is there somone's horned goat god, now the image for "the devil"


Quote:

Well you shouldn't feel good and smart for long. Sorry but the sentence you wrote is full of contradictions.

You picked that he spelt Moslum incorrectly, but you don't know how to spell it yourself. Muslim is the correct spelling, and did you consider that perhaps in his language it is spelt Moslum?

and "misspelling your religon" <-- wouldn't that be religion...?



look back a few, thats where I got my great sig from, again, emulation, and I'm following examples insted of doing my own thing.

Quote:

Sometimes a valid oppinion can slightly offend those who read it, because they take it in a way other than how the author intended it


I can say 'the cat ran up a tree" or crack a joke and somone thinks I insulted them, now I find it odd people are acctualy mad that I said somthing "hurtfull" I got banned from one place because some little girl couldn't read nor tell the truth. A year latter said people now see she was the wrong one and indeed a mouth frothing terror.
------------
end communication
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Gaius Abruscato

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 23, 2004 12:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I try my best not to take offese where none was intended. whether or not it was, I am going to put my thoughts and feelings about that topic aside, as I have already said what I will, and I'm certain it was all that really needed to be said by me.

So I now move to another response, involving another comment.

Quote:

Quote:

christianity did take the traditions and culture of many other beliefs into its own as a method of surviving and converting. That does not mean the only point to that religion is "converting poor soulless animals so I feel big."


so what does Rabbits and Eggs have to do with the real easter? and where did the word come from?
why is there somone's horned goat god, now the image for "the devil"


It seems you are aware of the pagan/wiccan holideay Ostara (spelling?) and of the adopted imagry of christianity. So without approaching the topic of holy war or religious extremism... immagine yourself trying to spread the word of a new religion, one that no one else has heard of. You hope to convert whoever you can. Best way to do so, incorperate a holiday similar to their own, by paralleling a part of your belief with theirs. Holiday of death and rebirth/celebrating new life and resurection.... matches with celebrating new life after a long winter. Why not make the holidays match? Birth of the son... goes with the birth of the sun. This way, adopting new beliefs with the old is much easier for newly converted.

As for vilification of the horned god... there are practical reasons for that as well. Imagery is something people create to match their religion. Nothing biblical says anything about bunnies or painted eggs, or about the devil having a strikingly similar image to the pagan horned god. In no way does the addition of that imagery make christianity less valid. Nor do I believe those traditional images in other beliefs make those beliefs less valid.

If anyone wishes to further discuss this topic with me, either in agreement or debate (I like debates quite a bit!) please feel free to message me, either here or on AIM. I am happy to chat about it any time. But for now I'm going to try to stop posting in this thread, or I fear I'll say too much. I understand religion, while a very interesting topic, is also a delicate one for many. I have no intention or desire to step on anyone's oppinion or belief. Years and years ago I did a lot of religious research. While it has been a long time, and I've forgotten a lot, I kept a strong admiration and respect for a countless number of belief systems. So I cannot say enough that I really don't want to end up offending anyone. I just like the topic.
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Maken

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2004 4:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

hay you out there , Iam a Muslim , and Iam proud really proud ..... well not too many Muslims around here , anyway I have heared and seen many offensive word , and I don't know why people argue about this matter .
like KWAZAR here .. ohh sorry Iam bad spellers , hay everyone knows his religion here , so keep your " talking about religion" stuff to yourself .
Sorry about this everybody , but I have to get it out .
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Last edited by Maken on Sat Jul 24, 2004 2:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
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kuwaizair

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2004 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

its the education, I was "classifyed" as learning disabled or, a brain gimp so they gipped me out of being smart.

Quote:

while a very interesting topic, is also a delicate one for many.


anything can be delicate for somone, I've ment people who'll seemingly break down and cry for saying in a monotone voice "i don't like purple", whilst purple being their favorete color. Then OH lord, then their lovers come and stab you because of the whiteknight syndrome.

see, thats why i'll spred religious beliefs in the guise of fiction, while JRR Tolken made up manily languages, I shall make up "religions", even if some i write painfully mimmic our own. Its all to show how horrid people can be.

but I'm glad somone mentioned holy wars........I felt like quoting somone's pride and mentioning holy crusades and witch burning and asking "these show how good people from your religion are?"

I find it odd, one will mock somone for wearing feathers or claws/teeth for spirtual reasons, yet the'll trek for many miles and pay lots of money to kiss a jewel encrused finger of a dead mayter.

same differance.
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Gustav Pendragon




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PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2004 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

just a general question out there to the various muslim posters here. What is your opinion of the Hadith and how would you rate its importance in religious matters? thank you in advance
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Kohaku

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2004 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Hadith is the second important thing after Quran. It's my oppinion. The prophet when he died gave us only those two things.

Hadith, are notes of what prophet Muhammad said and what he had done. It means as examples for us, Muslims, about all that we had to do in our life. The Hadith had two version, the real one (the shahih), and the unreal one (some people just made the things).

I believe in Hadith as much as those before me.

And a question from me, have you read Da Vinvi Code by Dan Brown, what do you think of Priory of Sion and the Grail?
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Shrew

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2004 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

The Da Vinci Code is annoying because it is full of half-truths. The Priory of Sion exists, but there is no evidence that it has anything to do with the grail.

There's a lot of evidence that Mary Magdelene had a more important role in the Church but was lowered in rank. She has been viewed as a prositute by the church until recently. Whether or not she had anything to do with Jesus romantically I can't say, although I doubt children would be so carefully hidden. It annoys me that the novel uses the Dead Sea Scrolls to support information regarding Magdelene; scrolls that are important because they <i>predate</i> the Gospels.

The Da Vinci Code uses a lot of conjecture and mixes it with facts and portrays it as absolute fact. It's really no better than the religion it is critiquing.
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Gustav Pendragon




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PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2004 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

the novel was a romantic novel which attempted to pass it self off as passed in reality. There were some interesting theories, but some very blaring historical errors that speak poorly on the author. Constantine made Christianity the official Roman religion, that's a laugh.

and by the way thank you for your thoughts on the Hadith. I have encountered a few different opinions on it from various muslims that I have talked to and am always interested in getting more information on the opinions of various believers.
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Njord

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2004 11:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

weekendwarrior77 wrote:
just a general question out there to the various muslim posters here. What is your opinion of the Hadith and how would you rate its importance in religious matters? thank you in advance


I agree on what Schala said and I would like to add something else. The Hadith is as important as the Qur'an for every Muslim, because without it we would not know how to do our rites most efficiently. The Qur'an told us that Muslims has to pray five times a day and has to fast in Ramadan but it did not say on how to pray to God or how to fast. It also said we must do many other things like the almsgiving after Ramadan and the pilgrimage to Mecca but as before did not tell us how, and here comes the importance of the Hadith. The Hadith explains why these things are important for us Muslims and how to do them accurately, it also teach us many virtues of our prophet Mohamed "peace be upon him" that we should take and live our lives with, so that is why the Hadith is important for us Muslims. :)
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Kohaku

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2004 12:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

You might also want to know that Quran was never changed from centuries ago. If we, the Muslims, are in need of new law (like about drugs, etc. that never happen before in our prophet Muhammad(peace be upon him)'s time, we use Ijtihad.

Ijtihad is a forum consists of various Ulama that mainly about discussing new things that occur in the modern life, and create new law if neccessary
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 2:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

well not mch to say about that topic for me... i don't really believes in any gods tought its tru that i sometime ( rarely) pray ( not hands together) when i wish for luck, when i feel afraid( yes i'mn human i know) or when i get into a pickle hehehe .....................
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Gustav Pendragon




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PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

So, the Qur'an was given to humanity by God via Gabriel and Abraham, spelling out what was required correct? If this is the case, why is there a need for the Hadith at all, since all that was required was already spelt out? You mention the particularies of certain events, but if the particulars were not mentioned, could it be inferred that they are no required by God. Of course, there would be nothing wrong with following the pattern set out by the Hadith, but it seems to be that it serves only as a guide and is hardly a requirment anywhere near as important as the Qur'an. Any input would be most appreciated on this subject.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Schala wrote:
Ijtihad is a forum consists of various Ulama that mainly about discussing new things that occur in the modern life, and create new law if neccessary

Unfortunately, the door of Igtihad seems to be closed in many Muslim societies today.

@weekendwarrior77: The Hadith contains the prophet's habitus and teachings, and therefore it contains the most divine guidelines a Muslim has access to next to the Qur'an. The prophet Muhammad is very important for Islam and he has tremendous authority - it's only natural for the members of the flock to aspire to follow his example.
There are three categories of Hadith: without doubt, good, and doubtful (the category is based on the credibility of the Isnad (the chain of transmission). The highest category is nearly as important as the revelation itself.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I'm protestant, a sect under Christianity. Simply, I have the belief that Christ died on the Cross and is the only begotten Son of God. My purpose is for relational growth with my Saviour, and to live a life of conduct patterned to that of Jesus' own life. Whew, that good? Hehe, simple.
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Gustav Pendragon




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PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Perhaps you could explain his importance to me, because as it stands, I do not see why the hadith is next to the authority of the Qur'an, although perhaps that is because I am basing it off of false pretexes. At any rate, I am under the assumption that he gained his authority because he was God's messenger and his purpose was pass along that particular message. From what i understand, the qur'an contains all that is necessary to live. If this is true then his divine authority should end there, because there was no longer the direct connection between God and him. I have seen no reason to consider things from the Hadith as divine in nature, since the prophets divinity began and ended with the Qur'an. From this standpoint I can not see how it can be viewed with such importance, however it is possible that I am missing something from the equation that you could inform me about.
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