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Missing true runes?

 
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Yvl

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2006 12:16 am    Post subject: Missing true runes? Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Warning: There are spoilers for Suikoden 1 - 4 in this thread.

I just finished Suikoden 4 about 22 hours ago. I don't know if there is an alternate ending with the 108 stars yet or not, but in the ending I got, the last thing I saw was Lazlo on a small boat, dead (he certaintly wasn't moving or breathing much, at least.)

Which brings up an interesting question: Where did that Rune of Punishment go? Wait, as a matter of fact, where did Windy's gate rune go, as well, or the Soveirgn Rune, or the Beast Rune, or the True Wind rune?

I had already jumped to conclusions by the end of Suikoden 3 - there's no way that all of those dissapearances could be a coincidence. My immediate reaction was to blame Leknaat, as she helped instigate most of those events.

Your thoughts?
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2006 12:28 am    Post subject: Re: Where mah true runes at?! Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Yvl wrote:
I just finished Suikoden 4 about 22 hours ago. I don't know if there is an alternate ending with the 108 stars yet or not, but in the ending I got, the last thing I saw was Lazlo on a small boat, dead (he certaintly wasn't moving or breathing much, at least.)

Which brings up an interesting question: Where did that Rune of Punishment go?


There is an alternate ending with all 108 Stars so I never really wondered about this.

Quote:
Wait, as a matter of fact, where did Windy's gate rune go, as well, or the Soveirgn Rune, or the Beast Rune, or the True Wind rune?


Windy and Barbarossa are not confirmed as dead. The Beast Rune was said to have disappeared from L'Renouille Palace but that's all, same with the True Wind Rune.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2006 1:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

One of the reasons Suikoden IV sucked is that the end really makes no sense if you don't get 108 stars. Every previous Rune of Punishment bearer turned to ash once they died, and the Rune chose another bearer. Sooo... how come Lazlo is intact enough to throw on a boat?

And even with the 108 star ending, using those same precedents, what sense does it make to throw him on a boat. If he's not dust and the rune hasn't transferred to someone else, then why would they just assume he's dead?

"Oh no, Lazlo's dead! But he hasn't turned to ash!"

"Oh snap! Throw him overboard before the rune gets on us!"

Says a lot for the fraternity among the stars of destiny.

As to where the rune went, it probably just hung out on Lazlo, as it's not killing him anymore. It's likely it works as just another true rune, granting agelessness. It's possible he died in the past 150 years, but then some dude's probably just running around the Island Nations with it. Dying and stuff.

Layfield answered the other ones. There's probably some dimensional party hall where true runes go to hang out.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2006 1:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I think one of the bits about turning to ash is that when Rune of Punishment left the old bearer when used and moved into a new bearer. When Lazlo used his and "died", the Rune of Punishment did not transfer to new bearer (there was no one there that could be its new host) and therefore, in my opinion, why Lazlo's body was still intact.

What I believe is that the old bearer's body would only turn into ash if there's a new bearer nearby. So Lazlo did die in the bad ending, and I'd assume that his body would turn into ash when the Rune of Punishment had found a new bearer (body would turn into ash as Rune of Punishment left Lazlo's corpse)

And going back to the initial question of missing rune, when the bearer is dead (like Luc, or Beast Rune's L'Renouille got destroyed), the True Rune has been said that they moved elsewhere (such as in a cave or underwater or other "quiet/hidden location") to lay dormant until they have found a new bearer.
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Thief

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2006 5:47 am    Post subject: Re: Missing true runes? Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Yvl wrote:
Warning: There are spoilers for Suikoden 1 - 4 in this thread.

I just finished Suikoden 4 about 22 hours ago. I don't know if there is an alternate ending with the 108 stars yet or not, but in the ending I got, the last thing I saw was Lazlo on a small boat, dead (he certaintly wasn't moving or breathing much, at least.)

Which brings up an interesting question: Where did that Rune of Punishment go?


I wish I could agree but you see, there is this one direct tie-in called Rhapsodia produced not long after to explain what truly happened to it after the war. And, yes, I did say 'truly'.

That, and looks like this topic is another proof that the assumption (that fans of the fantasy genre would have actually heard of the 'sea funeral' custom) does not hold. Lovely.
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Yvl

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2006 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I understood the sea funeral thing, I just couldnt think of what to call it. Anyway, I think that each rune has a destined host - hence why Lazlo didn't die when Brandeau used it, unless that was explained in the 108 stars ending (which I'm working on now.)

Is Rhapsodia the same as Suiko tactics? I never understood that. But that's the next game on my list.

But do you really think that those runes would remain dormant for long with the way Harmonia has been acting lately?
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2006 5:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Yvl wrote:
I understood the sea funeral thing, I just couldnt think of what to call it. Anyway, I think that each rune has a destined host - hence why Lazlo didn't die when Brandeau used it, unless that was explained in the 108 stars ending (which I'm working on now.)


I heard some speculation about this, and I must stress that it is speculation. I'm unsure of the truth of it, but it seems plausible.

According to it, Lazlo wasn't killed because his mother held the Rune of Punishment. He had some hereditary immunity to it.

Yvl wrote:
Is Rhapsodia the same as Suiko tactics? I never understood that. But that's the next game on my list.


Yes, Suikoden Tactics is the English name for Rhapsodia.

Quote:
But do you really think that those runes would remain dormant for long with the way Harmonia has been acting lately?


It would be difficult to find all those True Runes. Especially seeing how Harmonia is near the top of the Northern Continent. They'd have a hard time finding Runes in, say, the Southern Continent. I'm sure they try, though.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I'm sure the beast rune was taken back to Harmonia since it was Hikusaak that gave that rune to Highland in the first place.

I suspect that Leknaat might have the true wind rune with her since Luc died.
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uwangski

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 7:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Zelphiel wrote:
I'm sure the beast rune was taken back to Harmonia since it was Hikusaak that gave that rune to Highland in the first place.


It was speculated that the Beast Rune went to Highland on its own (and then Harmonia says "we gave it to them" as an excuse), so I'm not so sure about this one.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 8:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

It's not speculated, it's fact. The Beast Rune left L'Renouille after it's defeat at the end of Suikoden II, of it's own accord.
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Masa

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 11:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

The Wind Rune is probably the most decisive one. Other runes have generally transferred and we have at least some idea how that worked (such as True Fire, Beginning Pieces, and Sun Rune having been sealed to a shrine for X amount of time) or just generally passing on to another person. There's no telling what will happen to True Wind.

It does make me wonder what some of the these True Elementals were doing prior to 100+ years ago. After all, Geddoe - the oldest True Elemental Bearer, is just over a hundred years old. Sasarai and Luc are only thirty-ish, and Wyatt and the FC were probably around 80 years old.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Masa wrote:
The Wind Rune is probably the most decisive one. Other runes have generally transferred and we have at least some idea how that worked (such as True Fire, Beginning Pieces, and Sun Rune having been sealed to a shrine for X amount of time) or just generally passing on to another person. There's no telling what will happen to True Wind.


True Runes, when the user dies, actually disappear. The only Rune that transfers users is the Rune of Punishment, after it's user dies. The examples you mentioned were all sealed away. True Runes usually reappear in caves, and other such places after they disappear. It doesn't even need to be nearby. It's very possible that Luc's True Wind Rune reappeared in another continent.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

Right, this I know. And it's the only real case where we've seen a True Rune User die with the rune still with them. That's what makes it such a unique exception. Barbarossa and Windy are MIA, Neclord lost his rune before his death, and the Punishment Runes... again, an exception, and the True Water Rune passed on before Jimba's death.
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